37 thoughts on “$8,200,000,000+”

  1. WHAT ABOUT REAL LIFE? Do you people hunt or fish? Do you go for walks and think about why we exist? Do you look at the sky(90% of the time) and think it is beautiful? Do you revel in the fact that there are unknown truths beyond our own universe? Do you realize how easy it is to take life for granted? Do you have a clue? Or, are you all so focused on material things that you have lost site of “Real” life. I would rather not fully understand what you are all discussing here, but I have lost all contact with one of my friends that was getting into this stuff. I would like to grasp why that is. Also sorry about the introduction it just seems like people here are focusing on the wrong things in life. I would rather spend my time in the woods or something……
    So would anyone have any insight into why my friend remains distant, and yes I did turn him down when he “showed the plan” or whatever the @*&%.

    1. Jag Man, my answer to all those initial questions is – YES! That’s why I’m in Amway!! I can’t speak for your friend, but my Amway experience has been virtually the exact opposite of being “focused on material things” – it’s primarily been about getting time back and getting money out of the way as a problem. The people who I know who have been successful are then dedicating much of their time (and money) to helping people in need around the world – and truly enjoying time with their families when and how they want.

      Again, I can’t speak for your friend, he may be wildly motivated by a new ferrari. He gets to decide his motivations. Still, you may want to consider if your reactions to what he is doing is contributing to driving “distance” between you. He’s found a way he think can help him achieve his dreams. Are you supportive of that or dismissive? (and being supportive doesn’t mean joining)

  2. Hi Bridgett-
    I am very real; in fact you will see me at Leadership crossing as a new Silver. I would totally disagree with your spirit comment since every Diamond I have met has no sympathy for quitters. We all have tough times; we all struggle with succeeding but once you quit you divorce your upline and WWDB. But to be a dream stealer and spend your time blogging for negative is despicable and makes you the worse kind of quitter.

  3. Лично я ещё пока не решился заняться бизнесом Амвей, но продукцию эту использую и она мне нравиться.
    Я считаю, что прежде, чем предлагать что-либо другим, нужно самому это проверить, чтобы потом не выглядеть глупо.

  4. WWDBKevin,

    I don’t know you personally so I don’t know how “real” you are, and normally I wouldn’t comment, save for the fact that your handle has the “call letters” of my LOA.

    It is my experience that your comment to which ajgannon refers, is not in line with the spirit of WWDB, nor the views of the Diamonds of WWDB.

  5. WWDBKevin,

    Glad to see you’re in the pursuit! I’m an active IBO myself, so I’m on your side. However, that kind of response is a little too stereotypical of a “fired up” IBO who puts down people who leave the business. No need to feed the critics’ fire.

  6. I show 400 PV circles: 12 customers @ $75 (25 PV each) = 300 PV, plus your 100 PV self-use ($300) = 400 PV. The profit on approximately $900 worth of retail @ 30% would be about $270, plus your bonus would be around $72 @ 6% on $1200 BV, for a total of $342, which more than pays for your personal use. Of course these figures are examples only and you would need about 36 customers to have 12 that order $75 each month. This really works because this month, using this plan, is going gangbusters. Your customers come from your list of 100 names and your IBOs come from your customers that attend an open house. Trust me, this only works almost all of the time. When we have focused on building the organization, we have ALWAYS fallen flat on our face. When we do the biz this way, we have growth. Why? Because building a retail business takes the fear out of doing the business, you don’t have to hide the AMWAY name, and it gives people success right from the start. It might not work for everybody but it sure works for us. Of course, you can still prospect people for the business, but help new people build a big retail and they are making money right away. Also, using 400 PV circles, it only takes 20 people to go Platinum rather than 150. Sheesh, why work that hard? I’ll also say this about self-use: If you are not using $300 a month, you’re trying NOT to. Just my wife and I do more than that; some months it is $600. Best of all, using this system, you don’t need an EXPENSIVE, TIME CONSUMING system to keep people motivated. Success keeps them motivated and IN. But, you know what? This business just isn’t for everybody.

    1. excuse me but what is a PV circle? u mean each person makes 400 points a month times 20 hats 8,000 PV which is Platnium, but my question is, cant u just have lets say 180 guys within ur group of recruited people and just buy online for urself instead of selling, and lets say u and ur group mebers just buy products online, and within the group u make 7,500 PV doesnt that make u platnium?

      1. A “PV circle” is just how much volume an individual ABO does in a month, either from personal use, retail customer volume, or both. Retail sales by those actively building a business are sensible for a number of reasons, not least of which it helps cover business expenses. In some markets it’s also required. Also, for whatever reasons a lot of people shown the business model don’t want to join, it’s simply silly to reject them as retail customers.

  7. Thanks Bridgett!

    You are absolutely right. Most of the time, it is the people who makes the business bad. Because of this reason, still most of the people avoid this business a plague. See what happened in UK. Amway learnt it lessons and pushing for accredition among the “system” companies like BWW, which is really good. But I bet, most of the IBO’s dont have a clue what this is all about. Every busines/product has it target audience and it is an IBO mistake if he trying to sell ice to an eskimo. Again, skill are important. In my opinion, people should reduce the level of hype/exaggeration/false representation/false promises/deception/brain washing to take this business to next level. It is not going to go away completely as long as people are involved but that is the way it is.

    best wishes with your business, hope you achieve greater heights!

    cheers,
    Ravi

  8. Ravi,

    Ler first say that I understand where you are coming from. The business model that I currently build is not necessarily the one we “signed up” for years ago.

    I was not “into” retail when I first started our business. I fought it tooth and nail.

    Over the last few years, we’ve been strongly encouraged and equipped by our LOA to retail. And though I was not excited at first and very resistant, I finally “gave in”. 🙂

    I have to say, that once I started applying myself, learning simple skills like filling a need rather than selling a product, handing out samples and following up (none of which is brain surgery by a long shot) retailing has become, IMO, a breeze compared to other aspects of the biz.

    A major by-product that I didn’t realize until it started happening, is that the “pressure” of doing 100 PV, 300 PV, 500 PV, in our personal circle, that I used to feel, is gone, because it is no longer tied to our personal consumption.

    And now with the major retail profit that Amway Global is offering on their products, (more price adjustments to come in six weeks) there’s good money in retailing.

    Of course, just like the business opportunity isn’t for everyone, neither are our products. Identifying “eligible” customers is important.

    As far as the perception I feared people would have of me as a person who sold stuff, I made it waaaay bigger than it is. My customers don’t think any “less” of me ’cause I sell products. They love that they have someone to help them with their needs, and without any funky “I’m gonna try to get you in” vibe from me.

    It may be hard, at this point, to separate out what is Amway versus what is a specific kind of training (LOA). Intellectually, I know you know that they are not one in the same, but I’m sure they still feel one in the same.

    Good luck to you in whatever you pursue–whether it’s changing your approach with the Amway Business, or working at a job, or starting another business. Blessings to you and your family in all areas of your life. 🙂

  9. Hi ibofightback,

    You hit the nail on the head with your article “ABOs – Please stop selling Amway as a way to save money”. I myself freaked out so many times when presenter shows the plan like this. The lady comes up in the end of presentation and says, “i dont have to do anything, just change the buying location and still brush my teeth and use my perfume and show this to few people and make money” what a lie. I dont deny the quality of products that Amway sells. They are few of the best in entire world. But, when people feel deceived and lose trust they aren’t going to buy the products after they quit. It leaves a big hole in the pocket and bad taste in the mouth. Infact, i used to be specialist in sponsering people who already quit the business or -ve about the business. Most of the people i registered are from this category. How ironic! Hopefuly after the accredition programs taken up groups like BWW would change this.

    This business is like buying a razor; dirt cheap. But cartridges make you shell more money month after month. In the follow-up stage each prospect should be told about 30% myth (as it was made to understand in open) and make it clear how this works. One of the “Gala” diamonds says, sponser people who are well off financially who would not skip a meal or go on welfare, just because he is on standing-order(CD’s/books) 🙂

    Anyways, i have about 500CD’s accumilated over past few years, i will be selling in half the rate or would put in e-bay/craigslist. Any takers?

    cheers,
    Ravi

  10. Ok here is the deal. Let me come clear one more time. As i said in my initial posting i dint blame anybody, business or people. I blamed myself being a knuckle head (not)building the business right.

    I totally agree that if you not self motivated or doesn’t have people skills or sales skills you need to have a “system” supporting you. If it is BWW it will cost you around $5k/year (on tax form), if you are building with your spouse and have a kid. You cannot claim some of the expenses like baby sitting which is very expensive, especially where i live. Nobody can dispute that. Yes, this is optional but as I said..you will be suckered into it sooner or later. This is where you have to use your discretion and common sense.

    Coming to products. Take a common household and replace the products with Amway products and show me how to do a 300PV personal use with $750/month. How about 100PV with $250 as in SA 4400 or whatever it is. With much difficulty I could do 25PV to 30PV. I had to take vitamins, buy skin care, drink energy drinks etc to make it 100-300PV. This is *extra* money I was spending from my pay check which I was not spending when I was *not* in the business. Our retail is not that great either, it was on-and-off. All this extra expenditure is ok if you build the business right. If not, every first of the month it is like you are opening your commode(where you take your dump) and flushing your money down the drain. Only way to save your self is learn how to sell the products and be profitable very soon. Dont buy into anybody who says you dont have to sell, this is wrong. Of course there is a way in the web site where you “self consume” and report it as customer volume. Learn how to go “wide” and transfer this agony/skills(depends) to your downlines. It is not as simple as redirect your buying and do 100PV. That is a BIG LIE. Be ready to contact people in malls, shops and in public places. Officially, you *dont* have to do this but you have to do it anyway. I am not arguing it is right or wrong. Just be prepared to do it. Again, this business needs SKILLS/WORK/PERSISTANCE/THICK SKIN. If you are not ready for any of these, stop lying to yourself and go do your job. This is not a get rich quick scheme. 98% of the people in a typical conference have no clue what/why they are doing in the business and about their monthly goals. Some people are badly looking for couple of “suckers/legs” who can take them to platinum atleast. This attitude is not right. This is not fault of Amway but it is up to people how they build it. Is everything nice and rosy with Amway/BWW? Not really. Is everything is nice and rosy with your current job, most of the cases answer is NO. So moral of the story is use common sense which is very uncommon in this business too. It is very rare that you get lucky in this business. It takes work! Dont waste your hard earned money and your precious time if you are not serious. If you do that, it will be a very expensive hobby as it was with me. Learn your lesson and move on.

    Hope I clarified some of the things I said before. I know some of you still pounce on me saying me I am negitive, but thats ok 🙂

    By the way, if you are serious about the business, you will not be on these on-line forums taking opinions from “losers”, rather you would go show-the-plan!!

    best,
    Ravi

    1. Ravi, you might be interested in reading my post ABOs – Please stop selling Amway as a way to save money. If you are purchasing products “to make 100PV” rather than because you want them, then you are essentially operating an illegal marketing scheme. I’m aware that this isn’t just “you”, and some groups promote the idea of buying for the sake of PV, but to run the business professionally and with stability you need to develop legitimate demand – and that starts with you. I’d suggest though that that also starts with education – if you understand health, and understand the Amway products, then you will have legitimate demand for nutrition and skin care! I don’t buy them for PV I buy them because I want to be healthy, and they’re the best products. Do that and it’s easy to do 100PV+. But what if you can’t afford it? Don’t buy them … yet. Get out and retail more. Make money.

      I disagree with your assertion that you “have to” go out “contacting” in malls etc. My upline teaches simply to have a life – if you do so then contacting opportunities happen naturally. In the normal course of a life you meet dozens of new people every month. Does this work? Are you skeptical? My upline who teaches this is a Founders Crown Ambassador. I’ve never down the bookstore stalking and I’ve personally sponsored more than 40 people. It works. Have a life, meet people.

      But your right, treat it like a business and it works like a business. Don’t treat it like a business and the results are just as predictable.

  11. Everyone,
    Don’t waste your time going back in forth with the 2 quitters who want to hate and justify their failure. This is great news, in the worst global economy in decades we were up 15% and hit over 8 billion in sales! This is a time to celebrate, not defend our ever growing model with a 50 year track record.

    Tell the whiners to tell their sob story somehwere else, we could care less. I’ve never met a success in anything in life make excuses. Get over it and go back to your cubical!
    Freedom!

  12. I recommend that people take their initial list of 100 people, and instead of showing the business to them, trying to get them as customers. It is easier to build customers from people you know and showing the plan to people you don’t know.

    I also don’t think people should start out selling to businesses. Commercial selling is a whole different ball game.

    One thing that has helped me greatly is that I am the “sample king.” I give out a lot of samples. If I show a customer six items, I almost always sell one and sometimes two.

    These are just things I have learned on my own and have helped me.

    1. IMO the problem with that as a narrow approach (which I’ve learned both from my experience and that of others) is that the type of folk who tend to build large network marketing businesses often fail to see the potential when you take a “product first” approach. They see it as a part-time sales business, not as a potentially huge international marketing network – so you “lose” them.

      Brian Tracy believes that you can split people into 2 groups – those that relate better to theoretical models like “the plan”, and those that relate better to “hard examples”, like the products. If you focus too much on the one they don’t relate to, then they won’t relate at all.

      It’s a difficult line to straddle, my approach is to essentially offer elements of both and then adjust what I’m talking about depending on their response.

  13. You are right ajgannon, “fake 2500 PV” is someone who achieved that level once and has fallen from it since, but in open meetings and other places, he is treated as at 2500PV.

    I am also a strugling IBO, very much inetersted in business and selling products, but scared of investing too much money in it. Can we have a forum where we can share information about how to sell amway products successfully, I know one approach does not fit all, but atleast we can get some idea.

    I have tried selling to health clubs, did some expos, but have not been able to create a good retail base.

    1. Passed, if you’re a US IBO then you can try out the Sales Speak blog on the Opportunity Zone, it regularly has some good tips. There’s also the Amway Talk forums. In general though since every individuals circumstances are different, with different goals, different products of interest, different markets with different competitors, it’s generally best to start with your own local upline. Even if your own sponsor is not particularly into retailing there may be someone further upline who can be of help or recommended some good materials.

  14. I’m guessing “fake 2500 PV” means that he hit 2500 PV, but then fell below that level in subsequent months. Or possibly he hit that level by purchasing products for inventory, but didn’t move of all of it. Hopefully he’ll be back to clarify.

  15. I’ve noticed that when former, disgruntled IBOs mention how much money they spent on the business, they sometimes include Amway’s products in the total. That’s not an investment in the business (unless you stockpiled some inventory, which isn’t recommended, expecting to move it). Ravi, did you include the Amway products that you purchased for personal use in your $45-50,000 figure?

  16. Well, i WAS an AMWAY distributor for last 6yrs and just happy to quit last week. Here is what my honest opinion about the business. This is a very *good* business provided you *know* the small print. If you dont do this right, you will waste LOT of your money and LOT of your time. You get suckered into the “system” and it goes downhill from there. This is not a get rich quick scheme and like any other business you need to use your common sense. I spent close to 45-50 thousand dollars in last 6yrs and i dont blame anyone except me. There are many Amway “dreamers” who think they are going to make it just because they attend meetings and buy the products. It takes 5days/week for atleast 2-5yrs to get to a good level. That is the reason why 98% of the people *fail* in the business like me. If you are not serious, save yourself some heartache and money and do your job like rest majority working class and you will not be labeled as *loser/quitter* by *system*. If you want more details you can reach me at ravikanth_b@hotmail.com. By the way i was fake 2500PV 🙂

    -Ravi

    1. Ravi, I agree with most of what you are saying, but you need to be aware that not all LOAs and LOSs operate the same way. In our system for example there’s absolutely no tolerance for calling people “losers” if they’re not interested in pursuing the business.

      What’s a “fake” 2500PV?

  17. That’s excellent that you’re working through the accreditation process, Jeffrey! Also, you have a lot of constructive comments for the Corporation over on the O.Z. blogs. Thanks!

  18. AJ, I’m married and my wife went to the functions with me, hence 2 tickets, plus double meals, etc. Not all Diamonds are bad, not all Yager Diamonds and Yager functions are bad, either. I am even a dues paying member of my upline Diamond’s system, although I don’t attend functions, but I do buy an occasional CD or 2. The reason that I am currently a member is because his organization is accredited so that makes me accredited. I am currently re-working my presentation and training manual and am going to send it in shortly so I can get my accreditation. We have worked out our differences and we get along, but I just do not think the functions have enough substance to warrant the cost. If you and others find value in them and they actually help you build the business, by all means, go to them. I apologize for sounding so negative sometimes, but I was around before the systems got out of control and I feel that they have tainted the business. I am glad that major changes are being made.

  19. Six hundred dollars for a function?
    Dream Weekend a couple of weeks ago cost me $300 for the tickets, gas, and room and board for two nights. I guess you could hit $600 if you had to fly across country.

    I’m glad you’re doing well in the business, Jeffrey. Somehow, even though we’re both affiliated with the Yager Group, I’ve had different experiences than you. I’ve heard some quality teaching from the Yagers. I agree, sometimes I don’t pick up many nuggets. However, I don’t hear from them much any more. They’ve stopped coming up North to speak. I’m surprised that you base the quality of Yager functions on Birdie’s speech. That’s a pretty minuscule part of all the talks that an IBO will hear over the course of a year, probably 0.05% is generous.

  20. I’m in the Yager organization. I know what I’m talking about. I’ve been to some functions and Birdie stood up there and literally said nothing for an hour and a half. I mean literally standing up there and giggling and goofing around for an hour and a half and not saying anything. It was embarrassing. Holy Lord, if you don’t have anything to say, have a seat. I give people a lot of leeway. When I left the system, it was total liberation. Some training is needed for people to get a good start. I don’t have anything against proper training. It is when there is a $600 function every 90 days that doesn’t teach anything that I have problems with. Some motivation is also good, but if you really, really need a $600 function every 90 days so you can keep dragging your behind out of bed to do the biz, then this biz is not for you. I just decided that my name was not going to be Jeffrey J. Sucker anymore. Contrary to public opinion, I really like and care about the business. I work it every day. Sometimes people have to say some unpleasant things to get some things changed.

  21. Jeffrey, that’s not true. I’ve expressed some concerns about Yager functions during the Bob McEwen talk discussions. Therefore, I’m willing to acknowledge areas where improvements are needed. However, I’ve been attending Yager-affiliated functions since 2002, and we’ve always had a strong retailing and product education component in the training offered. The Yager-affiliated Diamonds that I’ve encountered do care about the people in and out of their groups. I applaud you for sticking with your business despite the problems you’ve had with your up-line and LOA. However, I believe that your perspective could be enhanced by enjoying a broader spectrum of colors besides black and white, with regards to business support materials, functions, and the IBO leadership.

  22. Hello BJD, ya the dollars are on product now Accreditation pretty much kill major tools sales and any alleged scams. Now people really buy what they need and it is all tracked online. Tools and such is old gossip find a new topic. The tools scams in North America do not exist. They even have a plan and traceable dollar amounts for the systems that are accredited. The new fulfillments are pretty cool. NO more tool scam. Focus is now on building sales of AG products and building teams with networks. You still need tools but people buy as needed. They fixed your complaints with technology. Next topic please. With all of this it is inevitable this will grow. So join the AG machine or do something accept complain about people who are willing to change and make things better by learning from past mistakes. The train in moving forward. Thanks to all the LOS for the Hard work. Many people did the right things and took a considerable pay cut in tools to make the business right again and retail back on the climb and they came thru.

  23. BJD was obviously in the Yager organization. Most of the Yager Diamonds do only one thing very well–move seminar tickets. They don’t care who succeeds or who fails and who stays in or qho quits. Most of them care about only one thing–moving tickets. All of the people in my group that were on the system are now long gone. The ones who did it right by developing a profitable customer base with high self-use are still in.

  24. Thats Awesome..Waiting to see which products did better this year.

    To BJD:
    I can tell you were not serious about business, you even don’t know what Amway Sells and what not. You spent $2000 on what? and was your total income $2006? or Just $6. If you would have spent $2000 on amway products, you would have got atleast $100 back from amway + Awesome Products.
    If that is the not case then you must be doing something really wrong, because even if you buy products worth $250, you make more than that. Buying motivational stuff is by choice.

    I know you were not happy about your business, thats ok, we not in business to make everyone happy. Like any other business, few gain, few loose. But atleast don’t distort the truth.

  25. As a long-ago Amway distributor, I’ll bet almost 80% of these sales were of their so-called ‘motivational’ materials, as that’s where they get their money from their distributors, that’s for darn sure. All I ever made in one year was a whopping $6 bucks! But I spent more than $2,000 grand!

    1. sorry BJD, but you lose the bet. Pretty much ZERO of that is “motivational materials”. Amway doesn’t sell them, they’re usually sold by a number of independent 3rd-party companies that offer them to Amway business owners.

      As a multiple-business owner, $2000 isn’t much to spend on a business …..

    2. Lol bjd is stupid i made more then i invested in my first month of buissness dumb lazy people lol

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