A common cry of the anti-Amway zealots is that the “odds” or “chance” of an individual being successful in Amway are low. They’ll typically look at some of Amway’s published statistics, such as the fact that in 2005, .0120% of “Direct Fulfillment IBOs of Record” qualifed at the Diamond level, and claim that your “odds” of going Diamond are 1 in 8333, so you’d be better off at Vegas, where your “odds” of winning on a single number in say, roulette are 1 in 29.
Oft-quoted anti-MLM zealot Jon M. Taylor, Ph.D., President, Consumer Awareness Institute, and Director, Pyramid Scheme Alert, for example, claims that -
The odds of winning from a single spin of the wheel in a game of roulette in Las Vegas is 286 times as great as the odds of profiting after enrolling as an Amway/Quixtar “distributor”
A quick bit of math shows that Dr Taylor thus claims the “odds” of profiting in Amway are 1 in 8294. He calculates these “odds” based on numerous assumptions (for which I might add, he has next to no data to support), including what peoples expenses are. Now, for the purposes of this post I’m going to ignore these type of assumptions, but if they are correct (they’re not) then his “odds” might be a reasonable statistic to consider, except for one thing – unlike roulette, Amway is not a game of chance.
For many people, the term “odds” is most familiar in the area of betting and horse racing, so I’ll use an example from that arena. The Kentucky Derby is one of the world’s biggest horse races. The 2008 Derby had 20 starters, of which (ties aside), only 1 could win. What are the odds than any particular horse would win? Using the thought processes of anti-MLM zealots like Jon Taylor, they’d be 1 in 20, or 5%. In reality, bookmakers provided betting odds that ranged from 50:1 (2%) for Big Truck to 3:1 (25%) for the eventual winner, Big Brown.
Why aren’t the “odds” of winning the Kentuck Derby for each horse simply 5%, as Dr Taylor’s Amway assertion would have you believe? Simple – horse racing is not a game of chance. Bookmakers take in to account many factors in deciding whether a horse is likely to win, including past performance, track conditions, the weather, the jockey etc etc.
The same principles apply to the Amway business. The “odds” of your success vary dramatically based on a number of factors. The first factor is, of course, determining precisely what “success” is for you. For example, in their investigation into a proposed new business opportunity rule, the FTC said that MLM company Shaklee reports 85% of folk who join that company do so purely to receive products at distributor pricing. “Success” for a such a person would be placing an order and receiving it successfully!
If this was your goal in joining Amway (and it is for many people), what are your “odds” of success, using the methodology proposed by Dr Jon Taylor?
Goal: Buy Amway products at distributor pricing
Odds of success: 50% (Jon Taylor methodology)
50%?!?!? Surely everyone who registers with Amway as an Amway business owner gets their products at distributor pricing? Well … yes (UK&ROI market aside, which has a slightly different model) … however statistics revealed in the Team vs Quixtar dispute of 2007 show that only 50% of folk who registered with Quixtar ever placed an order after joining.
I’m sure you’ll agree though, that shopping from Amway/Quixtar is not a game of chance. There are things you can do to influence your success – you could for example, actually place an order! Voila - your “odds” have suddenly doubled to around 100%.
Dr Jon Taylor, Robert FitzPatrick, and other anti-Amway zealots such as “JoeCool” and “Rocket” would have us ignore not only what an individual’s goal(s) are, but also factors that influence that goal. Clearly this is a ridiculous and indefensible position. In Dr Taylor’s case, it’s a disgraceful one, as he is the holder of a Ph.D in Applied Psychology from the University of Utah. Having qualifications in psychology myself, I can assure you that you do not achieve a Ph.D. without a reasonable grasp of probability and statistics.
With regards to MLM statistics, Dr Taylor is either delusional or utterly dishonest.
So what are the real odds of success in Amway for various goals, and what factors influence them? Well, clearly if your goal is wholesale price purchasing, then your odds of success are close enough to 100% if you place an order. Just as clearly, someone who joins and never even places and orders products is extremely unlikely to ever make any money. Indeed, I would suggest the probability of success for that group is 0%. Using this kind of information, just like bookmakers with horses, we can come up with “odds” that better reflect reality.
The 2008 Amway Global Sales Incentive Brochure reports for example that 0.3685% of North American IBOs qualify as Platinums or higher – that’s about 1 in 271. Yet we know that half of those 271 never even place an order, so their “odds” of reaching platinum were effectively zero. So …
If you place an order, your odds of being a platinum are about 1 in 135.
The TEAM vs Quixtar lawsuit in California also revealed that only 23.4% of Amway business owners ever sponsor anyone. While I’m sure there are folk who have qualified platinum purely on customer sales, without having sponsored anyone, it’s likely that the percentage who do so approximates zero. So …
If you sponsor at least one person, your odds of being a platinum are about 1 in 63.
Refining it further, the TEAM case revealed that only 12.9% of Amway business owners ever receive a bonus on downline volume. To receive a bonus you have to have a downline and at least 50PV of customer volume, plus be at a higher bonus bracket than the downline.
If you qualify for a bonus on downline volume, then your odds of being a platinum are 1 in 35.
Let’s put this in perspective. If all you do is join Amway and do enough to earn a bonus on downline volume, then already your “odds” of being close to developing a business earning $50,000K/yr+ (Q-12 Platinum) is approaching 1 in 35 – compare this to Dr Taylors simplistic claim that the “odds” of simply making a profit are 1 in 8294 (0.01%)
Clearly, earning a profit in the Amway business involves a lot more than simply signing a form and paying the registration fee, as Dr Taylor and others would have us believe. Taking action makes a difference! Indeed, the BERR vs Amway case in the United Kingdom revealed some even more astounding statistics -
- only 6% of agents bought Amway products to sell on
- 10% of agents make a profit
Leaving aside the fact this shows Dr Taylor’s claims re profit were out by a factor of 1000(!!!), it also reveals something else. It’s a reasonable assumption that those agents who made a profit included virtually all of those who onsold the product to consumers. If so -
if you have customers, then your “odds” of making a profit from an Amway business are approximately 100%
Amway is not a game of chance. It’s a business. Treat it as such and the odds of success are clearly very good indeed.
Sphere: Related Content
Asking to see an upline’s tax return is like asking your boss if you can see his/her tax return. It’s nobody’s business.
This obsession that some critics have with seeing people’s tax returns is bizarre and illogical.
Wouldn’t copies of their checks from the Corp be better “proof” for their Amway income?
????
Why do some blog articles awaken the mischiefmakers like “n.j.n” and “m.n.”, while others don’t budge them from their slumber? Maybe it depends on how scholarly and profound the article is. Wisdom is correlated with stupid attacks in the response thread?
Visioneer,
When (if) you make platinum, you will have done what the others (just like my emerald) have done. You will have led so many to believe that you are successful tht you will be too ashamed to show your tax returns. Anyone who stands on stage & claims to make X amount of dollars in income and then refuses to ever prove it is someone who is all talk and no action. From the comments I have read on this article even the most ardent supporters of Amquix admit that the words plarinum or emerald are basically meaningless as they may be making money or scraping by. You answered my question exactly as I knew you would. It will be interesting to see how you feel if you discover that your upline has been deceiving you. Ofcourse, you will have to actually be open to the possibility of that being the truth instead of blindly following his stage performances.
john,
It is none of yours, or anyone’s business what I pay in property taxes, donate to charity, how many dependants I take care of, what I pay sub-contractors, what I pay an employee, what I claim in captial gains, what I claim in income that is not from the Amway Corporation, and all the other non-Amway-business-related information on my tax returns.
It is ridiculous to “demand” IBOs to share their tax returns as “proof” of Amway income.
If an person is so inclined, if the information from the Corporation regarding incomes is not sufficient, then they can ask to see copies of an IBO’s checks from Amway.
But to ask to see tax returns?
Illogical at best, and insulting at worst.
Is anyone else noticing any trollish behavior?
Visioneer,
I know you will make Platinum and beyond. You have a healthy First Circle and will be able to help others make money, because you are making money.
Keep up the great work and keep your eye on the goal!
Thanks Bridgett!! Same to you!!
To Not Joining Now:
The simple fact is you live in a Free Enterprise society and you have the right to build this business or not, period. The problem that most of the 3 million Ibo’s around the world have with critics like yourself is that you decline the business and spend the rest of the time backing up your decision with negative.
The Facts are Amway/Quixtar are over a 7 billion dollar debt free company and we are going to do 8 billion next year. We are #1 in North America for Health and beauty and the #1 affiliate partner for Circuit City and Barnes and Noble.
Let us know why you decided to get over it and then move on my friend. Since you have zero experience in this business your posts have no validation. Thanks.
WWDB Kevin
http://www.thetruthaboutamway.com/
Great logic and systematic approach to a very irrational question in the first place. Think and act like a business person and your chances of profitability are 100%. To address the opposition posts, I am a Silver Producer who has been very profitable for many years from a base of business that put together in my first couple years in the industry. My income has been very passive when considering the 5-10 hours per month I have been allocating over the past few years.
The issue to think about for those that do not continue their investigation after reading this post, if you are looking for a reason to not get started that is what you will find. BTW, in my experience the only thing these individuals ever start after passing on this opportunity is the TV, their XBOX, a bowling league or something else that does nothing to add value the ther future.
Freedom,
Your last sentence correlates with a story I heard once. When an IBO asked his friend when he could see the plan, the friend said “let me check my schedule”. Then he pulled out the TV Guide schedule!
WWDB Kevin,
According to Ron Puryear and Greg Duncan, Quixtar was going to be a $100 billion business 3 years ago. And yes, I can provide the source of their statements. So who is telling you how much this business is going to grow and are you sure you want to trust them? Also, success for Amway Quixtar owners (Devos,VanAndel) doesn’t translate to success for you or the millions of others who have been decieved by the likes of Puryear and Duncan.
Unfulfilled promises of growth in the dotcom world weren’t exactly the unique provence of a handful (note: handful out of thousands) of Quixtar leaders.
Are you claiming that if some Diamond out of thousands makes a prediction that later turns out to be wrong, that means the business somehow doesn’t work? Seems a bit of a silly approach to life to me.
I’d like to dispute your claim that it was just a handful of Quixtar leaders making this claim. I would argue that the majority of leaders were making this claim. You seem to ignore how communication gets transferred in these organizations… from the top down.
The majority of the INA leaders were all saying the same thing back in 1998 about Quixtar becoming a $100 billion dollar business. If the major leader of an AMO says it, you can bet all of the downline leaders will be duplicating it on stage, in team meetings, and Amvox.
Us critics who were last active decades ago were right there when Quixtar was being launched and can attest to these claims. If a minor AMO like INA would be promoting Quixtar as a $100 billion business, you can bet that the likes of Britt, Yager, Foley and other kingpins were saying the exact same thing.
The business has and does work for some people, but is it working for you? A 1 in 35 chance is still just 2.9%. I don’t know about you, but that’s still a pretty low percentage to me. What about the other 34 people? If they’re not Platinums, what are they? Some might be 1000s, 2500s or 4000s, but I bet a lot of them are scraping by at 100PV or even lower.
Obviously, I’m not going to stop anyone here from building the business, but I caution people in thinking that this business will build itself if you would only do the work. While that sounds nice on paper, it like the 6-4-2 circles, doesn’t always work out in reality.
Just my thoughts on your stats and percentages, IBOFB. As always, feel free to ignore if you don’t agree.
Amthrax
Being an IBO who would be a part of that $100 billion, I can say that I only have to look in the mirror and see one reason the company didn’t go to $100 billion.
I am not responsible for the other hundreds of thousands of IBOs in North America. But I am responsible for myself.
And I take responsibility for my part and my lack of effort for not making the company’s sales larger than what they are.
Argue it all you like – have you got any evidence to support this claim? Again though – so what? People all over were making ridiculous claims about dotcom businesses. I said at the time the claims about Quixtar were silly, and I said it about other businesses too. Somebody making silly claims has no bearing at all on whether the business model is any good or not.
You seem to have missed the fact that chance has nothing to do with it, and that we haven’t even yet got *close* to working out the statistics for people who do what is recommended.
it will build itself if you would only do the work …????? Huh? Does that make sense to anyone?
John,
We are going to be a 100 billion dollar business; the timeline for when that happens is irrelevant. I love that the leaders of World Wide and Quixtar/Amway Global are optimistic and looking towards the future, that is how you grow a business. Do you think Bill Gates ever predicted huge growth bigger than what Microsoft has become? Of course that is why he is a visionary, all great leaders are.
I am successful in the corporate world and I have yet to meet a self made millionaire who was skeptical, critical, and “realistic” in their future growth.
For you John to sit back from the outside and pick that statement apart has no merit to someone building the business. Get in the fight or go home and do nothing, that is your only 2 options. I choose to get in the fight and it sure has paid off.
Do what is recommended is exactly what the System leaders teach from stage. The 5 steps to success. The 9 CORE steps, etc., etc. The reality is you can do all of those steps and never get to Platinum, Emerald, or Diamond.
When I wrote, “this business will build itself if you would only do the work” that’s paraphrasing what the leaders were saying from stage.
Every time I’ve seen a survey done of people who have truthfully done our “core” steps every month for the previous 6 months, they’ve virtually all been silver and above. QED.
Very very very very very few people do “core”. Just yesterday I was listening to an MP3 of a new Double Diamond, he said of the people in the seminar where he was talking (already a highly self-selected group), he’d estimate from his experience about 5% were core the previous month – and that’s just for one month! Every time I’ve seen “core” recognized in a large meeting, the numbers have been much the same.
N21 “Vital Signs” and WWDB “parameter” statistics show that any given time about 10% of IBOs attend seminars. 5%*10%=0.5%. So only 1 in 200 do Core even for the one month!!!
Be honest – if only 1 in 200 do it for just one month, how many do you think do it every month for 2-5 years?
Amthrax,
I appreciate your criticisms as you are very reasonable to converse with. However, I have personally found that doing the work and following the mentorship of my upline provides results. I have not reached the Platinum level yet, but I have 10’s of thousand of dollars in the bank from my business, I have a nice profit at the end of every month, I’m almost debt free, and a have a large investment portfolio (although its been shrinking lately
). My wife works part-time and we’re looking for her to be free from her job next year.
Part of “doing the work” is learning from your mistakes and continuuing to work at getting better. This business is an art, based on a science. If you show 10 plans you should sponsor 2-4 people. However, if you have terrible people skills you probably won’t sponsor anyone. You’ll have to work on yourself to improve your sponsorship rate. So part of “doing the work” is getting advice and actually listening to it and then folowing through. I’ve seen too many people try it for a few months, then give up. I know they are selling themselves short. They put in too little effort, for to short a period of time before the give up on themselves.
That’s why reading is so important. I am a part of a large church that has grown fairly quickly in the past 10 years. Our Pastor is very well respected and he is an awesome leader. He reads an average of 3 books a month! He is at what some people would call a pinnacle of success, yet he still works at improving himself daily.
I am probably the most average of anyone who has ever built this business. I am not smarter than most people, I am not the “motivational speaker”, I am not a gifted communicator, I wasn’t born with a high leadership quotient.
But, I am very happy I decided to follow the advice of my upline and kept working at my business!
IBOFB, I agree with you, that success here or anywhere else has absolutely nothing to do with “chance,” “luck,” or “odds.” As you, WWDBKevin, Visioneer, and others point out, it does come down to choosing to be successful and doing the required work — in any activity, not just a direct sales business such as ours.
The question that has not been effectively addressed by any side, however, is why so few who register a direct sales business — and this is true, by the way, for many direct sales businesses, not just Amway Global — continue on to put in the required consistent effort to achieve the level of cashflow they deem to be “success” for their purposes, whether at Platinum or higher, or at some net cashflow positive sub-platinum level.
This is still an area that needs to be explored and “transformed” and it won’t be with words on a blog, but by builders who set out to understand the problem and define an approach and training that will facilitate a shift in individual business’s growth and success. That is a “problem/opportunity” in our marketplace waiting to be solved.
I agree, but playing the devil’s advocate, the question arises as to whether this is an inherent part of human nature, and we can’t change it, or it is something to do with techniques/approaches/strategies, and we can improve it.
Probably worth starting a thread on AmwayTalk to discuss this.
John,
Go ahead and post the following:
Full Name
Mailing Address
Birth Date
Social Security #
Mothers Maiden Name
And I’ll send you a copy of my Tax Returns for the past 6 years along with a copy of the $20,000 achievers check due to arrive in 11 days. (Not that I’m counting)
Sounds pretty silly doesn’t it???
rdknyvr, great question. And certainly could have its own blog site to answer it.
But to over simplify it. I’ve always seen this industry as being simple, not necessarily easy. If you want more of the general public to “stick with it”, you’re gonna have to make it easier.
Than the question would be, can you make it TOO easy. I think so. One of the greatest things I’ve seen with this business is far beyond the financial rewards, but rather, who you become through the process. And if the process is too easy, you elimante some of the need for personal growth and development in order to be successful.
Thankfully, there are alot of sharper minds than me working behind the scenes with the transformation that understand this balance and have a passion for what this business is and can be in the future.
Thanks TWS, I was thinking, in part, more along the lines of being more careful, and do more screening of who we end up sponsoring. Some people will never know if they have or can develop the motivation and vision to build their own business until they try. Others could never do it in a light year’s worth of Sundays, but they are looking for an “easy” way to get a business/money (ie. no effort) and they should be screened out at the beginning. They are often the ones who end up with the cockroach/critic stories… per some above… shine a bit of light on them and they scurry away.
However, I’m not entirely content to leave it to the so-called “sharper minds” working behind the scenes, some of whom still may have an unexamined conflict of interest regarding which business is more important to them… Amway Global or a training system. One still sees a lot of the old assumptions not being re-examined… the old saying, ‘if you keep on doing what you’ve always done but expecting different results’ is the definition of ___. Same with thinking… keep on thinking, or failing to innovate in your thinking even around business building approaches, and there is the risk of building the old flaws into the new ‘transformed’ business… maybe the “new wine in old wineskins” analogy fits.
If you’re worried about “training systems” then I think you’re jumping too far ahead. While the success rate of people who buy BSM (as opposed to put it in action) may not be that great, it’s way way way way better than the success rate of people who never buy BSM.
1. Why do most people who join never place an order?
2. Why do most people who join never participate in any training, even free stuff?
then you can get to -
3. Why do most people who participate in training/purchase BSM never put it into sustained action?
4. Why do most people who put the training/BSM into sustained action never sustain it for long enough to reach higher levels?
rdknyvr,
I think your answer would be the same reason why people join health clubs, pay their monthly membership, and never or rarely show up.
Or, they do show up, but their work out is so lame, that they might as well go sit in a park, enjoy the fresh air, and eat a doughnut.
The IDEA of being in shape is far more appealing than the reality and the WORK it would take to be in shape.
Yes, but the REAL question is then – what can be done to improve your “hit” ratio?
In my opinion we have a very effective business system, but there’s still room to make it more efficient.
There are for examples things you can do to increase “compliance” on things like gym attendance and diet programs. How can we increase “compliance” (Note to critics: It’s a research term, nothing nefarious meant by it) with Amway/system programs?
In my opinion, as Jeffrey pointed out earlier, a person can be involved in all the bells and whistles and environment of the business but aren’t actually doing the necessary work to move their business forward.
And then the biz becomes a spectator sport for many IBOs/ABOs (and critics, as well). They are in the stadium, but not on the field.
People get caught up in watching the “show”, rather than performing.
For some people, that is all they want. They just like being around it all, but not really interested in performing.
I appreciate the availability of all the resources. I just think IF we are looking to make money with the Amway Opportunity, we have to know when something goes from being a resource to being a distraction. And that’s different for different people. This is not a one-size-fits-all endeavor.
So I believe IF we want to make money, it’s to evaluate when/if a resource goes from helping us build our business, to allowing us to deceive ourselves about just how much true effort we are putting forth.
We all need to make sure we keep the main thing, the main thing.
Way to be visioneering!!!!AS long as I’ve been in the business I’ve seen that the people who put in correct effort in the business have always got a result. A lot of people stay consistent and move to the higher levels and those who don’t stay where they are or fall back. It is like anything else, if you want success, you need to learn what to do and apply it properly..
This has been a fun post, with a lot of great opinions. Here is my two bits: my Awesome upline teaches me that the 1st six months of consistent & persistent effort may yield nothing. We may not see ANY growth for the first while, but that 7th month goes “boom.” The Slight Edge (Jeff Olsen, author) teaches this very effectively–if one hasn’t heard of or read this book, I highly recommend it. It is the very tangible, daily things we are doing that will eventually show the results (ie. core, which btw have ten steps). We must soe before we reap (sp?) and I do know this: that most people get excited when they see this biz model, show all their friends & family and none of them “get in,” so they say it doesn’t work & they quit. They haven’t even had the fortitude to move from the JV team to the Varsity team, and it is sad; but it is human nature. It is too bad that those who we are the closest too, we listen to & believe the most–where they’d rather one not succeed, or move onto better themselves, so as to not make themselves feel so bad about themselves (if that makes sense.) I cherish my time with those in this business who’ve had success, to learn from them and gain the strength and knowledge I need to follow in their footsteps. It’s much better time & money spent than hearing all my “broke, derilect (sp) neighbors and friends talk about their financial geniuses over nascar, beer, barbeques and block parties!
Thanks for all of your above posts..
ibofightback where do you live?
and what do you do for a living, other then being an IBO?
These days I live in Europe. I have a number of different businesses.
the business does work, you just have to get coached by people who have created an income and just do what they have done. It’s funny that the people who post complaining are the one’s that quit, it’s a choice if you succeed or not in this program.
That right there is hard for people to grasp, it’s not that the business doesn’t work, you just didn’t work it.
fin
I’ve been following this website for quite some time and I believe that Amway does work. I have heard about Amway since I was young, and married a man who was a member for almost 10 years, because he believed in the products (his first wife died of cancer and he was looking for good quality vitamins) and as a businessman, he also saw the opportunity and over the years, he had built a steadily growing network (retention rate 80%) and also, the income is inheritable (my 3 stepsons and their generations to come will benefit from this gift of perpetual income).
I married him last year and refused to have anythng to do with Amway as I didn’t like direct selling or mlm and never believed that I could do it, but after visiting Vietnam, and seeing the business opportunity and how fair this business, equal opportunity regardless of whether you are young or poor, old or rich…and in Malaysia where I come from, we have many Diamonds, some of whom qualified at 26 years old and now I reside in Brunei…small population of 391,000 inclusive of foreigners. Despite this size, our business is growing faster than ever, despite the recession.
Most importantly, having beginning to be active in this business since March 2008, I have myself personally put in about 60 people, and seen more than half making some income…which helps cover some of their vitamins cost and some even make extra income.
One of my friends just lost his job last month due to the recession, and having joined our network 5 months ago, he has a small sum of Amway income every month since the last 3 months. It may not be huge income…yet…but it is money chasing after you, especially when you are down and broke and don’t have a job.
We believe that Amway can help change some peoples’ lives, if only they try to do something about the opportunity. Yet, sadly, most sit still, do nothing and complain that Amway is a scam etc when they DIDN’T EVEN TRY. It’s just like going to university. If you don’t study, you may fail. In any business or in life, if you don’t work hard or put in effort, how can we expect results?
With Amway, my family enjoys steady income, great health (we are 100% users), peace of mind, gained new friends and also, more time to share with our loved ones.
This business works. My upline joined at 29 years old and retired at 31 years old. For the last 12 years, he has never worked (and he used to be a medical doctor in hospital – long hours…what good is earning tons of money when you don’t have the time to spend it…like in a conventional job?). He tells us….one of the most important benefits of this business…is that now, he has plenty of time to spend with his family. He saw his kids through delivery, goes on holidays whenever he likes (no need to wait for public holidays and peak seasons), and has since he first turned Emerald 12 years ago, been on every Amway holiday…5-star all the way.
This is my opinion, and I will continue to build Amway and help others (those who believe that they want to do something with their lives and future) to help themselves. With Amway, I have also gained self-esteem and more confidence in myself.
IBO Fight Back,
This is a very well written article. I got bored reading through the first half of comments, but your article was a good read. Having advanced degrees in the Sciences, logic comes very easy to me, and there is nothing wrong with your logic, however i see no logic in the arguments. The methodology was fine.
Your critics call your article a long explanation, but have clearly never seen what “long” is… Try having to prove an experiment worked, the 3,000th time.
-UCLA expose
Holy crap what a bunch of whiners.
Great article man.
The people who say things can never be done should get out of the way of the people who are doing it.
YLW – I have good reason to suspect most of that “bunch of whiners” was the same person. I seem to annoy them
Those people who focus on “odds” clearly do not see the big picture.
Unfortunately, business opportunities such as Amway/Quixtar attracts people who want to make money the easy because of the promises… and that is simply not the case. As with anything that has the potential to earn you a lot of money, you have to work HARD (make connections, talk to people, sell your products like your life depends on it, etc.). You have to have a game plan, otherwise you won’t make any money. Sell=profit… find atleast one person who is willing to work hard=profit.
i recently joined amway. second month in business. And honestly i have a great team. i get the fact that to be successful in amway you may need to turn all your liabilities into assets. Even your time, friends, and words. the pricing is reasonable, the partner stores are credible. the discounts are awesome. The business is simple, but people are complicated. im currently working hard to dumb it down. lol.
IBOFB though your post says that the Phd guys stats were not true tot he facts, i must say i didnt find much fact finding in your analysis also.
In the end ur stated chance are some 1 in 35 at the best and its still not competitive to sitting on a table in Vegas with a roulette having 29 numbers.
Though i must concur that the chances and % for achieving success depends on many factors in real life and i personally feel that business success depends on the business owner and not on the business.
But still you haven’t stated the success road map for amway. Am personally not good at people tackling skills and sweet talks (even if its with correct figures and facts) and if i join amway, would depend mostly (say 90%) on sales that my website and/or retail store (which i may open after joining amway) generates. How in your experience and opinion would this business pave a road ahead for likes of me considering its mostly difficult to explain the reasons for high cost of products to customers on a website and also in a shop.
Please do reply me.
Nazgul, this is a business. Chance plays virtually no role. If you think it does, then I suggest you do not start ANY business. What facts do you disagree with in my analysis?
As for the “success road map”, I’m not the one to ask. It’s a different road map for different people. If your plan is to setup a webshop and hope people come to you, then I frankly doubt you’ll have much success. As you say, you can’t easily and well explain the products benefits compared to the competitors. That’s essentially the role of the IBO, if you’re not willing to do it, then don’t expect to succeed in the role. Having said that, people skills are a skill, not a talent. You can learn them if you want to. IMO, they’re crucial for success in virtually all aspects of life, from relationships to jobs, to business. You might want to consider the benefits of improving in this facet! IMO Amway groups are some of the best in the world at teaching this.
As much as your determination drives this business, just because you follow the plan of ANY business does not mean you are going to be successful. It is certainly a possibility to make money with Amway, but it’s not a guarantee even with determination.
Hi there,
I was in Amway from 2002-2005, and I can tell you without question that the reason I didn’t make the money I wanted was my own fault. Amway was great – I needed to develop the skills to develop a large network. The truth is that Amway distributors are more skilled at creating loyal organizations of people than any group of people I’ve ever ran into in my life, and I respect them for it more than almost any group of people in the world, even though I choose to pursue other options at this point in time.
Sure, after 3 years of painstaking hard work I had a grand total of 2500 pv, but the fact is – I would have had more if I had developed greater skill.
-David Wood
P.S. one thought – although I understand the ‘roulette’ comparison, Amway diamonds earn a significantly higher income than the average person, so a more fair comparison would be comparing the odds of going diamond to the odds of any single person in the united states becoming a millionaire. Most adults set out with the intention of making more money than they do. For example, people with a net worth of a million dollars according to wikipedia are 0.62% of the population. Now granted, that’s still more of the population that are millionaires than diamonds, but diamonds have some pretty cool lifestyles.
Rather than BASHING what the average person doesn’t do – why not commend the diamonds in Amway for becoming a 1 in 8333 kind of person? That takes some gusto.