I’ve occasionally participated on a website called scam.com. There’s regular duels there between MLM supporters and anti-MLM zealots with their usual falsehoods and misconceptions. Back in August 2011 a poster joined using the nickname Joecool44. As of writing this post, he has, since joining scam.com contributed 3,473 posts, at an average of nearly 10 posts a day. The majority are posts attacking Amway.
If this all sounds familiar, it’s not surprising. Back in March of 2011 I highlighted the obsessive and fraudulent behaviour of an anti-amway blogger and internet commentator who goes by the name of Joecool. In that post I pointed out his obsessive behaviour, averaging more than one fully fledged blog post a day, and literally thousands of comments on blogs around the ‘net. I also showed how he was setting up multiple blogs and pretending to be different people. All in an effort to disparage Amway and Amway IBOs.
Joecool has continued his obsessive blogging, with nearly 400 blogposts across the 3 blogs he admits to since I wrote that post a 15 months ago, as well as continuing with his anti-amway commenting around the internet.
But here’s where things begin to get interesting. Over on the scam.com site, several of the other members have been challenging Joecool44 about his identity. As regular follows of Amway critics know, it was revealed some years back (not, initially, by me) that Joecool, the anti-amway blogger, was a former IBO in Hawaii by the name of Steve Nakamura, downline of Diamonds Scott and Cris Harimoto. He had been an IBO in the mid 1990’s, for less than a year. Internet sleuths, and some people who apparently knew him offline, had revealed that Joecool aka Steve Nakamura, a married man, had been a regular contributor to a sex and prostitution focused website, World Sex Guide, describing his exploits with illegal prostitutes in Honolulu. (as Joecool18, Steve411, and Steve Nakamura). While initially defensive, joecool/Steve eventually owned up to all of this, said he was working for forgiveness with his pastor, and he deleted his blog, where he had been accusing someone of threatening his family and blaming me for it.
Fast forward to 2011/2012 and joecool the blogger, as well as joecool44 the scam.com poster, have been denying they are Steve Nakamura or even knowing who he is. Whenever commentators have addressed him by the name Steve, he’s responded with comments like “Who’s Steve”? What’s even more bizarre is that obsessive anti-amway scam.com poster Joecool44 refuses to even acknowledge he is obsessive anti-amway joecool the blogger. It’s gone so far that over the past year he has challenged two other posters there “every cent they’re worth” to prove he is Steve Nakamura, and last week he bet me $50000 his name isn’t Steve Nakamura. Not surprisingly, he refuses to put any funds in to an escrow account to back this “bet” unless any of the people he has challenged does so first, and he has also refused to agree to any conditions which might prevent him getting out of things on a technicality (eg getting someone else to write the actual text whenever he says “I am not Steve Nakamura”.)
It’s all a bit silly and childish, but I’ve had a little fun baiting him over the whole thing. Frankly who he is doesn’t really matter that much, unless Amway or IBOs need his real identity in order to sue him for tort defamation, which – after this post – they very well might consider.
So, despite knowing the chance of him ever paying out on his bet is below zero, I figured I may as well dig up and post the evidence, just to show him for the fraud he is. Little was I to know that I’d make further discoveries that offer even more proof of this man’s utter lack of integrity and illegal behaviour.
Now, please forgive me, this is a very long post. But bear with it, it’s worth it! And let me know in the comments if you think Joecool owes me $50,000.
Who is Joecool?
People often think they’re anonymous on the internet, but it’s incredible how much information is available – and how often we give it away ourselves – even when trying to remain anonymous. One of the most obvious is when we register on a website or forum, where we often are required to give and confirm an email address. Sometimes websites publish these email addresses, sometimes they don’t. In Joecool’s case, he was a (very) active participant on a the forums of a now inactive website called QuixtarBlog. His email address, steve12301@yahoo.com, was publicly displayed with every one of the more than 6500 anti-amway posts he made on that website.
While many sites, including for example Facebook and LinkedIn, don’t publicly show your email address unless you explicitly allow it, they still allow you to search for members using their email address. That’s how Joecool’s MySpace account (with, if I recall correctly, his real name, now deleted) was discovered. When they do show your email address, it’s easy to then connect different posts you’ve made on difference sites, and connecting the dots can reveal all sorts of information.
In 2008 JoeCool himself admitted on his then blog and elsewhere that he was indeed Steve Nakamura (see The Joecool Threat Story Part I). Here on The Truth About Amway, Joecool even confirmed that his antagonist that originally emailed him about the World Sex Guide had his first and last names correct. I was sent copies of those emails. What were the names? Steve and Nakamura.
Furthermore, on an another anti-Amway/Quixtar blog, What is Quixtar, run by someone using the name Curious George, unknown commentators posted the following comments –
John said…
Well, his wife left him recently.
LOL
Anonymous said…
JoeCool is Steve Nakamura and his wife is Noreen.
Right Joe?
Anonymous said…
Hey JoeCool/Steve, you still living in Kaneohe near Angie’s market?
John said…
joecool is steve nakamura and lives with his wife in Kaneohe. He works on the campus of the university of hawaii as an auditor and is employed with grant thornton auditing. he used to be in amway under harimoto and he was downline from a direct leg under the name of yanagawa from california and had a designated upline who he counseled with on oahu.
There was even a link to a submission to the FTC about Amway, from a Steve Nakamura of Hawaii –
Anonymous said…
Steve/Joecool?
http://www.ftc.gov/os/comments/businessopprule/522418-05825.htm
What was Joecool’s response?
Joecool said…
So you know a little bit about me. Big deal, what are you going to do, show up at my house for tea and crumpets?
SEPTEMBER 9, 2008 11:01 AM
He confirmed the comments were correct. You’ll find that all of those comments link to the original blog post where they were made. The last comment, by Joecool, doesn’t have a link. Why not? Because a few days ago it disappeared. More about that later. Fortunately I have a copy of the entire blog post and comments, which was forwarded to me by a friend who had printed it out as a PDF file last week.
So we have Joecool himself apparently confirming he is Steve Nakamura, but a lot of the harder, public, evidence, like his public email address on QuixtarBlog and his MySpace profile are no longer available. So last week I did something simple and ran a google search for it again – and some very interesting results were returned. Joecool had been commenting on two anti-amway blog posts, and the bloggers had exposed information on the people commentating in a publicly available file. Now this is quite a serious breach of privacy, so I’m going to notify both bloggers of the problem, but I’d like a significant number of readers of this site to be able to access one of them first, so they can see first hand exactly what a fraud Joecool, ie Steve Nakamura is. I’ve kept copies obviously.
The file comes from the blog Luke Himself, where an anti-Amway article was published in 2006. If we search for Joecool’s earlier known public email address, “steve12301@yahoo.com” in the file, nothing is found. So why did it show up in the google search? Well, yahoo.com is a common part of an email address, so it’s probably picked that up from somebody else’s email in the file. “steve12301” however, is not so common. And it gives us the following comment, in the form of the WordPress tags used to publish the website –
<wp:comment> <wp:comment_id>1101</wp:comment_id> <wp:comment_author><![CDATA[Anonymous]]></wp:comment_author> <wp:comment_author_email>steve12301@hotmail.com</wp:comment_author_email> <wp:comment_author_url></wp:comment_author_url> <wp:comment_author_IP>132.160.237.20</wp:comment_author_IP> <wp:comment_date>2008-12-11 08:54:07</wp:comment_date> <wp:comment_date_gmt>2008-12-10 22:54:07</wp:comment_date_gmt> <wp:comment_content><![CDATA[This was from another forum: "Amway as an example is easy to get caught up in the hype but in the end many of their top producers don"t make much in Amway but make tons in the sale and marketing of their "Inspirational & Motivational Products" One of the Amway big wigs used to live up the hill from me in a multi million dollar mansion. Once you get to know him you find out all his money didn't come from down line but rather speaking events, that he was paid to speak at. He actually made only 10% of his money from his down line (about $20k a year) and the support from that actually came from others putting people in for him and not the work he did himself. "]]></wp:comment_content> <wp:comment_approved>1</wp:comment_approved> <wp:comment_type></wp:comment_type> <wp:comment_parent>0</wp:comment_parent> <wp:comment_user_id>0</wp:comment_user_id> </wp:comment>
An anonymous anti-amway comment from somebody using the email address steve12301@hotmail.com. Coincidence? I think not. Furthermore, I know Joecool had been commenting on that blog post, because I’d commented there as well. So what’s the obvious thing to do? Search for “joecool” instead. What does that give us?
A comment by Joe Klein, email address joecool06@excite.com claiming deceptive behaviour by Amway organisation Network 21 –
<wp:comment> <wp:comment_id>932</wp:comment_id> <wp:comment_author><![CDATA[Joe Klein]]></wp:comment_author> <wp:comment_author_email>joecool06@excite.com</wp:comment_author_email> <wp:comment_author_url></wp:comment_author_url> <wp:comment_author_IP>132.160.237.20</wp:comment_author_IP> <wp:comment_date>2008-11-14 04:01:17</wp:comment_date> <wp:comment_date_gmt>2008-11-13 18:01:17</wp:comment_date_gmt> <wp:comment_content><![CDATA[I was once invited to a meeting. I was told it was a job opportunity and when I arrive, I was dismayed to find out it was an Amway meeting. The person who invited me asked mt to have an open mind so I observed the presentation. The speaker said they are not Amway, but recruiting for network twenty one agents. He said Amway is a private seperate company and they supply network twenty one agents with goods. After the meeting, I had decided that it was not a good fit for what I was seeking and I politely declined to join. I was dismayed when I overheard some gyus in suits saying that people who don't join "don't get it" and will wind up being broke.]]></wp:comment_content> <wp:comment_approved>1</wp:comment_approved> <wp:comment_type></wp:comment_type> <wp:comment_parent>0</wp:comment_parent> <wp:comment_user_id>0</wp:comment_user_id> </wp:comment>
That seems to be a bit of a big coincidence too, doesn’t it? Joecool06? Smoke … but is there fire? Well yes, it happens there is. The data includes the internet address of the person posting the comment. It’s the same in both comments: 132.160.237.20 – A computer at the University of Hawaii. You’ll recall that the whistleblower on the What is Quixtar blog said that Joecool was Steve Nakamura and worked at the University of Hawaii. That smoke is getting hot! What else can we see? Well, we can search the file for that IP address, and see if there are any more posts from that computer. Surprise, surprise, there are.
First we have the “Joe Klein” comment above. Next comes several from “Brook” (ibo_fightback@yahoo.com), allegedly a former IBO with Amway and Network 21 and claiming deceptive practices. Needless to say, despite Brook’s email address, it’s not me –
<wp:comment> <wp:comment_id>1078</wp:comment_id> <wp:comment_author><![CDATA[Brooke]]></wp:comment_author> <wp:comment_author_email>ibo_fightback@yahoo.com</wp:comment_author_email> <wp:comment_author_url></wp:comment_author_url> <wp:comment_author_IP>132.160.237.20</wp:comment_author_IP> <wp:comment_date>2008-12-09 06:23:30</wp:comment_date> <wp:comment_date_gmt>2008-12-08 20:23:30</wp:comment_date_gmt> <wp:comment_content><![CDATA[I was in Amway/Network twenty one for a while. They told me a lot of lies and half truths about how the business works so I finally quit. My sponsor was always more worried about me attending meetings (at a cost) than he was about me selling products . I finally saw through the facade and walkes away a bit poorer, but wiser.]]></wp:comment_content> <wp:comment_approved>1</wp:comment_approved> <wp:comment_type></wp:comment_type> <wp:comment_parent>0</wp:comment_parent> <wp:comment_user_id>0</wp:comment_user_id> </wp:comment>
<wp:comment> <wp:comment_id>1080</wp:comment_id> <wp:comment_author><![CDATA[Brooke]]></wp:comment_author> <wp:comment_author_email>ibo_fightback@yahoo.com</wp:comment_author_email> <wp:comment_author_url></wp:comment_author_url> <wp:comment_author_IP>132.160.237.20</wp:comment_author_IP> <wp:comment_date>2008-12-09 10:44:14</wp:comment_date> <wp:comment_date_gmt>2008-12-09 00:44:14</wp:comment_date_gmt> <wp:comment_content><![CDATA[Lies - I was told that I don't have to sell product. When I asked how you earn an income without selling, I was told that I get compensated by purchasing for myself and sponsoring a lot of people who also purchase from themselves. I said that did not sound like a business. My sponsor told me that there is no profit from the sale of seminar tickets. When I discovered there was a profit, my sponsor then said there was a profit but it went back to the into the business to make other tools more affordable. I thought it was hogwash. The folks who promote the network twenty one system is the "they". They are more interested in selling tickets than anything else.]]></wp:comment_content> <wp:comment_approved>1</wp:comment_approved> <wp:comment_type></wp:comment_type> <wp:comment_parent>0</wp:comment_parent> <wp:comment_user_id>0</wp:comment_user_id> </wp:comment>
<wp:comment> <wp:comment_id>1086</wp:comment_id> <wp:comment_author><![CDATA[Brooke]]></wp:comment_author> <wp:comment_author_email>ibo_fightback@yahoo.com</wp:comment_author_email> <wp:comment_author_url></wp:comment_author_url> <wp:comment_author_IP>132.160.237.20</wp:comment_author_IP> <wp:comment_date>2008-12-10 03:06:50</wp:comment_date> <wp:comment_date_gmt>2008-12-09 17:06:50</wp:comment_date_gmt> <wp:comment_content><![CDATA[It sounds like you give my sponsor a pass. He always told me he was plugged into the network twenty one system and was teaching right out of the network twenty one playbook. He told me that selling product was not important. He said the networking and sponsring people is where the money was made. He also told me that I needed to attend the expensive meetings or I could not succeed in the business. Is that how network twenty one passes off responsibility? By teaching their people wrong things and then claiming that they have no responsibility because they did not pass on the information correctly?]]></wp:comment_content> <wp:comment_approved>1</wp:comment_approved> <wp:comment_type></wp:comment_type> <wp:comment_parent>0</wp:comment_parent> <wp:comment_user_id>0</wp:comment_user_id> </wp:comment>
<wp:comment> <wp:comment_id>1099</wp:comment_id> <wp:comment_author><![CDATA[Brooke]]></wp:comment_author> <wp:comment_author_email>ibo_fightback@yahoo.com</wp:comment_author_email> <wp:comment_author_url></wp:comment_author_url> <wp:comment_author_IP>132.160.237.20</wp:comment_author_IP> <wp:comment_date>2008-12-11 05:01:16</wp:comment_date> <wp:comment_date_gmt>2008-12-10 19:01:16</wp:comment_date_gmt> <wp:comment_content><![CDATA[My sponsor did not say anything about a network twenty one handbook. He said he was teaching me the same vital information that the network twenty one leaders taught. I was constantly told that my lifeline to success was plugging into the network twenty one system and to attend all meetings. I did what I was taught but there was no progress and I realized that the time, money and effort was not going to produce what was advertised so I left the business. I don't know about scam but Amway and Network twenty one are not "all that".]]></wp:comment_content> <wp:comment_approved>1</wp:comment_approved> <wp:comment_type></wp:comment_type> <wp:comment_parent>0</wp:comment_parent> <wp:comment_user_id>0</wp:comment_user_id> </wp:comment>
When I was an active IBO I was affiliated with Network 21. Brook’s comments did not fit my knowledge and experience with Amway and Network 21 at all. I initially engaged her in the comments on that site, but began to believe she was probably Joecool or another critic faking a persona. I called “her” out on it on the site and “her” comments stopped. Now we know.
Next comes a comment from “anonymous” (steve12301@hotmail.com) –
<wp:comment> <wp:comment_id>1101</wp:comment_id> <wp:comment_author><![CDATA[Anonymous]]></wp:comment_author> <wp:comment_author_email>steve12301@hotmail.com</wp:comment_author_email> <wp:comment_author_url></wp:comment_author_url> <wp:comment_author_IP>132.160.237.20</wp:comment_author_IP> <wp:comment_date>2008-12-11 08:54:07</wp:comment_date> <wp:comment_date_gmt>2008-12-10 22:54:07</wp:comment_date_gmt> <wp:comment_content><![CDATA[This was from another forum: "Amway as an example is easy to get caught up in the hype but in the end many of their top producers don"t make much in Amway but make tons in the sale and marketing of their "Inspirational & Motivational Products" One of the Amway big wigs used to live up the hill from me in a multi million dollar mansion. Once you get to know him you find out all his money didn't come from down line but rather speaking events, that he was paid to speak at. He actually made only 10% of his money from his down line (about $20k a year) and the support from that actually came from others putting people in for him and not the work he did himself. "]]></wp:comment_content> <wp:comment_approved>1</wp:comment_approved> <wp:comment_type></wp:comment_type> <wp:comment_parent>0</wp:comment_parent> <wp:comment_user_id>0</wp:comment_user_id> </wp:comment>
The same address we were originally looking for, but at hotmail instead of yahoo. It’s followed by a comment by “Sam” (whatisquixtar@gmail.com), again attacking Amway and Network 21 –
<wp:comment> <wp:comment_id>816</wp:comment_id> <wp:comment_author><![CDATA[Sam]]></wp:comment_author> <wp:comment_author_email>whatisquixtar@gmail.com</wp:comment_author_email> <wp:comment_author_url></wp:comment_author_url> <wp:comment_author_IP>132.160.237.20</wp:comment_author_IP> <wp:comment_date>2008-09-30 10:56:27</wp:comment_date> <wp:comment_date_gmt>2008-09-30 00:56:27</wp:comment_date_gmt> <wp:comment_content><![CDATA[Beware of amway and network 21. They are deceiving and only interested in selling you tapes and tickets to meetings where they act like a big cult.]]></wp:comment_content> <wp:comment_approved>1</wp:comment_approved> <wp:comment_type></wp:comment_type> <wp:comment_parent>0</wp:comment_parent> <wp:comment_user_id>0</wp:comment_user_id> </wp:comment>
Did you notice that last email address? Yup, it’s the title of the anti-Amway (then Quixtar) blog What is Quixtar, by Curious George. Yet another Joecool blog? Stay tuned.
So, we now have clear evidence of one person posting as 5 different people in the this section of the comments available on this blog. The email addresses he used were –
- steve12301@hotmail.com
- joecool06@excite.com
- ibo_fightback@yahoo.com
- whatisquixtar@gmail.com
But why stop there? I have access to the log files and commenting information for another blog. The site you’re reading. You can be assured I keep this information confidential – unless of course you engage in fraudulent behaviour, as it’s clear is happening here. I plugged that IP address in to my comments administration panel and what came up? 24 comments from “Joecool”, using the following email addresses –
- hawaiianibo@yahoo.com
- Hawaiianibo1@yahoo.com
- steve12301@yahoo.com
- Joecool@hotmail.com
Furthermore, I found a comment from a blogger who had received anti-amway comments from ibo_fightback@yahoo.com on her blog, and was somewhat confused to then find my(mostly) pro-Amway TTAA website. We also know he has been posting comments under at least all of the following user names –
- Joecool
- Joecool18
- Joecool44
- Steve
- Joe Klein
- Brook
- Peter Parker
- Curious George
- Derek
- Sam
- Anonymous
So, we have conclusive proof that “joecool” has been fraudulent posting anti-Amway comments under multiple personas, and in some cases (eg Brook) clearly defaming the Network 21 organisation as well. This is clearly illegal behaviour and goes far beyond “free speech”. On top of this we have evidence that suggests the anti-amway What is Quixtar blog is yet another joecool creation, following on from the earlier faked “Peter Parker” and Derek blogs.
Is Joecool Steve Nakamura?
So we have joecool admitting critics knew his identity, and we have the emails about the World Sex Guide which he admits had his name correct, but is there any clear, publicly available information to confirm it? As it happens there is, though you can expect he’ll remove it as soon as he can after I publish this post, so be sure to check it yourself (and confirm you have in the comments!) Let’s start with the easiest one.
The easiest way to find someone on facebook is to plugin in their email address in the search field. Let’s try steve12301@hotmail.com and see what comes up. Bingo! (Update 2012-08-07: He’s now deleted or renamed his Facebook profile. Update 2013-09_10: just checked and it’s back)
Just to be sure we somehow don’t have the wrong person, here’s Steve Nakamura being a pest on Amway’s Facebook pages (1)(2), even promoting his own blog!
A google search on facebook.com finds him harassing people on the BWW facebook page as well –
And here he is apparently conspiring with a partner in crime –
LinkedIn doesn’t allow you to directly search for people using their email address. It does however let you search for people you have in your email contacts list. So I added steve12301@hotmail.com to an email contact list and imported it. Bingo!
MyLife (formerly Reunion.com)
MyLife doesn’t let you search via email unless you’re a paid member. But guess what? You can google search them and they use the start of the email address for the profile address. Bingo!
So – we know conclusively that Joecool=steve12301@hotmail.com=Steve Nakamura. There’s just one last thing to address.
Is Joecool44 on Scam.com anti-amway blogger Joecool aka Steve Nakamura?
Earlier I alluded to the fact that a comment from 2008 (four years ago!) where Joecool confirmed that another commentator had accurate information about him (ie his name was Steve Nakamura) had mysteriously been deleted in the last few days. What could have triggered that? Well, Tuesday last week, while debating with Joecool44 on scam.com, I cited this information as evidence that Joecool=Steve Nakamura. Not long after, he disappears.
So, the blog is called What is Quixtar. Joecool uses the email address whatisquixtar@gmail.com, and when Joecool44, who is claiming he is not Steve Nakamura, is presented with this evidence, it suddenly … after 4 years … disappears. That in itself would be enough to subpoena blogspot for their logfiles. But we don’t need it. Why not? Because Joecool44 has already admitted he is Joecool.
That’s the problem with obsessively posting thousands of anti-Amway comments. It can be really hard to keep track of the lies you’re trying to cover. You’re sure to slip up somewhere. Let’s read what Joecool44 had to say on scam.com back in November 2011 –
I have a collection of nice emails and letters from people who avoided being scammed because of information I have provided.
…
“I prospectively attended my first AMWAY fucntion this evening. I’ve spent the last several hours online; from what I’ve found Joecool’s account is not the exception but the standard. I have a meeting with my sponser tommorow evening, where I’ll be returning the information he gave me and politely decline.Honestly, if I had only read Joecool’s testament of failure; I may have given the sponsor an opportunity to ellaborate on whatever success he has had with this system, and further considered getting involved with this organization; however, the arrogance and malice expressed by the AMWAY supporters on this site, have undoubtedly convinced me that this is not something I want to be a part of. ”
“Joecool; I’ll never know how much heartache your website has spared my family and I; but, I believe it’s considerable, and I am grateful”
Guess where else this “story” is posted? It’s a comment on Joecool’s blog! He even goes on to highlight it in a blogpost.
Hung by the tongue. In his own words, Joecool44 is Joecool anti-amway blogger is Steve Nakamura of Hawaii.
Pay up Steve, you owe me $50,000.
I lost a friend (G Inglefinger) to Amway. Amway alienated him from all his friends. He started looking after himself, he consumed Amway products exclusively. He tried to sell these products to his (ex) friends. He shaved his beard. He said he will achieve his dream of owning a Porsche in 5 years (he never did).
The focus, consistency and determination with which Joecool aka Steve Nakamura is publishing blogs, comment on his blogs with different user names is commendable. I guess if he had put even 50% of it by doing Amway business he would be much successful. Forget Amway, if he had taken a course and put in 10% of efforts to improve his skills, he would have increased his earnings by about 5 times minimum in last 10 years
Thanks for this on Steve Nakamura aka Joe Cool 44.
I’m on scam.com and this self righteous bastard has the cheek to preach hell fire and damnation to “sinners” when in truth he’s got lots of skeletons in his own closet of conscience. He’ a smart ass troll and too fond of hit and run comments. Well done and thanks.
IBOFightBack,
Do you think JoeCool gets paid for posting negative blogs (defamation) about Amway? I dont think he gets paid for views, I think he gets paid for CONTENT publishing.
He who has such an unhealthy obsession with trying to bring Amway down.
I read an online article that explains, defines, and helps us understand the exact behaviors of these poeple. They are called “Internet Covert Agents” who are hired by agency companies to defame whatever target that they are objected to attack. There’s an entire explanation behind JoeCool’s actions….
https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2014/02/24/jtrig-manipulation/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ioaYVrSvf3w
Nah, I think he’s just nuts.
Interesting article though! Thanks.
Read the article. Haven’t visited their (joecool and anna banana) sites for about a year – until now. They have been rehashing these issues for years. Nothing worth responding to. They are stuck in a rut and are enjoying the view. (How much can one see with one’s face down in the mud?) Neither have been part of Amway for a very, very long time. Yet they both try to give the impression that they are up to date. Doubt anybody that is seriously considering becoming involve with the Amway business pays much attention to their negativity. Actually, they may be doing the business a service with their constant, ignorant ranting – especially “AB”.
and yes, he owes you 50 000
this is waaay too funny and interesting. i like this!
LOL hey IBOFightBack, I think I really hurt Steve Nakamura’s feelings.
In his latest blog: http://amwayscheme.blogspot.com/2013/06/a-better-life-after-amway.html#comment-form
I basically told him to get a life, quit being a 46 year old loser trying to make money off his blogs, and I told him that he was pathetic.
I told him that ever since IBOFightBack exposed his ass, nobody has been commenting on his blogs or nobody really believes who he is anymore. He got so offended that he threatened to ban me and deleted my comment. LOL!!
What’s also funny is Joecool Stevie Nakamura likes to pretend that he has an audience backing him up. He posts under Anonymous and acts like he has other people reading his blogs and supporting his blogs and ideals.
It’s quite hilarious how pathetic he is. But this isn’t the first time he uses a fake persona to back up himself right? Hahahaha
Don’t you think this is getting a bit childish? These kinds of posts are no better than what you are accusing him of doing. Unless that’s what you are trying to do. It’s just a troll war. Aren’t you trying to defend amway? These posts are not helping your cause.
“These kinds of posts are no better than what you are accusing him of doing.”
So are you calling ibofightback a liar? Do you have proof of that? Because that’s what ibofightback is claiming of joecool, and, unlike joecool’s accusations, ibofightback provides substantial proof of his accusations.
“Aren’t you trying to defend amway? These posts are not helping your cause.”
Why wouldn’t these posts help his cause? If the Amway corporation, products, opportunity, IBOs, are being wrongfully maligned, then wouldn’t showing that such statements are coming from unreliable sources be helpful?
If I read a review that slams a movie, the actors, the crew, and the movie studio, wouldn’t I look to the credibility of the critic in determining the credibility of the review?
Or do I just take everything at face value and think, “Well it’s in print, it must be true!”
Hi Bridgette, sorry if I came off that way but I was replying to the guy who said he enjoys trolling. Even if joecool may not be the best example, someone purposely trolling seems bad form. As I said earlier, ibofightback has good points but joe cool actually has some good points also. I think joe is wrong though if he is faking stories to make his point.
Ah, I see. I misread who you were talking to. Got it.
No problem. I’ve been reading joe’s blog and some of his posts make sense and are good to know. Some of this blog’s points are good also. Kind of just wonder where this flame war between blog authors began? Seems to just be a difference of opinion and no need to trash one another.
by the way, do we know if JoeCool is making money off his blogs?
well, I have to say it’s starting to be a little odd with how much blogging and commenting he does – but only during business hours. For a moment I thought maybe he was in prison, but apparently no prison internet access in Hawaii 🙂
http://amwayscheme.blogspot.com/2013/06/what-are-your-amway-ibo-expenses.html#comment-form
He’s saying that people make money off of kate voicemails, when that’s not even true at all.
He doesn’t even know how Kate works, and when I confronted him with how kate works, he threatened to ban me and avoided the question. It’s obvious he is talking out of his ass.
You can see me posting as anonymous in his comments section. Be aware though, I enjoy insulting his manhood and his status altogether, for all the shits and giggles.
Hey IBOFightBack, I’ve been invading on JoeCool’s blog these recent 2 days just to piss him off.
Every time I talk to him I include his name Steve Nakamura to taunt him and I always mention how he was involved in that illegal prostitution shady business.
One thing that he kept saying though is that he is not Steve Nakamura. Though it’s hard to believe he is not, who knows, do you think it’s another ghost writer who picked up the alias Joecool to hide his butt?
I’m sure all the evidence you have of the former Joecool is Steve Nakamura, but I get a feeling there might be a slight possibility that their could be a new JoeCool (anonymous) who picked up the old Joecool’s work where he last left off. Is there any way we can confirm this gray area?
Still using the same IP, same writing style, same guy.
I guess if this post says he’s got fake personas and has hidden his tracks, there’s a good chance he is not really “Steve nakamura”. That makes sense to me. Does anyone know him in real life and can confirm or deny those?
Just wanted to add this…
I’m ohein56 at scam.com.
I was banned for 10 days today because I posted links to this blog.
joecool44(scam.com member) aka joecool (Anti-Amway blogger) alias “steve nakamura?”, apparently complained that I was breaking scam.com forum rules…
Rule #4 – “4. NO POSTING OF ANY MEMBER’S ADDRESS, PHONE OR FULL NAME. Do not post your own, you don’t know what kind of nutcase will decide to track you down.
Now, if joecool44 aka Joecool isn’t Steve Nakamura, why did I get BANNED for posting a members name then???!
As far as I’m concerned, this whining to scam.com admin is just further confirms who joecool is…
If this blog were BS, joecool44 would have just ignored it…make sense?
Hi Kerry,
You should know that my real name outside of the Amway world is not Steve Nakamura. Steve Nakamura is simply a pen name I created to protect my identity.
What’s the deal on being banned? Are you sure you weren’t just being a jerk? You remind me of a blogger named “Tex” who couldn’t help himself and got banned on nearly every blog he posted on.
Just zip up your pants in the front and get on with life. 🙂
So are you saying you were lying not only when you accused someone of threatening your family, but also when you said they knew you’re real name?
And you’re saying you were lying when you admitted it was your real name on the whatisquixtar blog?
And you’re saying you were breaking the law and using a fraudulent name while signing legally binding contracts?
Go get some therapy, Steve.
Why was I lying about being threatened? In your article, you claim I lied simply because you didn’t see the threat yourself, You lied by saying I received no threats. I was able to trace the threatening email to someone in Ontario and I wrote an article about it on my blog. It’s still there. Go read it.
I never admitted anything about my name or identity. You are also lying about that. I said “you know some things about me”. I never admitted anything about my name or identity. You are taking liberal editorial interpretations to fit your agenda.
Who said I broke any laws? Not any worse than you using hidemyass.com to try and disguise your internet tracks on my blog. you’re lucky Qblog is defunct because you had admitted it on a thread in that forum.
I doubt you will publish this post.
Steve,
(1) you said the person who threatened you knew your real name. Are you denying that now?
(2) You had a Facebook page, a MySpace Page, and a LinkedIn page using the identity Steve Nakamura. All of them have contractual terms of service requiring you to use your real name. You either committed fraud while signing up with those services, or you’re lying now about your name.
(3) If I want to hide my tracks on the internet I have far more sophisticated means than hidemyass. Would you like me to demonstrate?
Do you think his Employer knows how he is wasting his time and their network use?
As a former IT professional, it was easy proving he was posting from UoH :
[Querying whois.arin.net]
[whois.arin.net]
#
# Query terms are ambiguous. The query is assumed to be:
# “n 132.160.237.20”
#
# Use “?” to get help.
#
#
# The following results may also be obtained via:
# http://whois.arin.net/rest/nets;q=132.160.237.20?showDetails=true&showARIN=false&ext=netref2
#
NetRange: 132.160.0.0 – 132.160.255.255
CIDR: 132.160.0.0/16
OriginAS:
NetName: PACCOM
NetHandle: NET-132-160-0-0-1
Parent: NET-132-0-0-0-0
NetType: Direct Assignment
RegDate: 1989-02-22
Updated: 2012-04-02
Ref: http://whois.arin.net/rest/net/NET-132-160-0-0-1
OrgName: University of Hawaii
OrgId: UNIVER-25-Z
Address: 2565 The Mall
City: Honolulu
StateProv: HI
PostalCode: 96822
Country: US
RegDate: 2010-01-05
Updated: 2011-09-24
Ref: http://whois.arin.net/rest/org/UNIVER-25-Z
OrgAbuseHandle: ZU32-ARIN
OrgAbuseName: University of Hawaii
OrgAbusePhone: +1-808-521-2879
OrgAbuseEmail: netcontact@hawaii.edu
OrgAbuseRef: http://whois.arin.net/rest/poc/ZU32-ARIN
OrgTechHandle: ZU32-ARIN
OrgTechName: University of Hawaii
OrgTechPhone: +1-808-521-2879
OrgTechEmail: netcontact@hawaii.edu
OrgTechRef: http://whois.arin.net/rest/poc/ZU32-ARIN
RTechHandle: TN11-ARIN
RTechName: Nielsen, Torben
RTechPhone: +1-808-956-3499
RTechEmail: torben@hawaii.edu
RTechRef: http://whois.arin.net/rest/poc/TN11-ARIN
#
# ARIN WHOIS data and services are subject to the Terms of Use
# available at: https://www.arin.net/whois_tou.html
#
I was an IBO in Hawaii around the same time as JoeCool. I was recently contacted to join Amway again so I was looking for information and wound up here. While I agree that Joe seems obsessed with dogging Amway for past issues, I don’t see this story and expose as someone taking the moral high road. You just got in the mud bath with Joe and started exchanging mud pies. If what Joe claims is false, people will see right through it and dismiss it like they would if a guy stood on the street corner claiming the world will end next Friday. What you have done is made it a personal battle between the two of you and you both look quite juvenile.
Makes me wonder though, if I might have actually known this guy when I was in the Amway business.
Unfortunately people don’t see the things he (and other critics) say as false. I once analysed the letters published on Scott Larsen’s anti-amway site and well over a third of them were people saying “thank you, your site as made me decide not to join!”. I encounter all the time people who cite the type of lies on websites like JoeCool’s as “evidence” of things. This is a guy how has been creating fake personas and pretending to be an IBO, and creating fraudulent stories in order to disparage Amway. People need to see him for what he is – an outright fraud.
I agree with IBOFightBack. My business was wiped out in the early stages after new IBOs and prospects I worked with did research on the web, citing sites like Joecool’s.
IBOFightBack,
For readers who don’t know you well, you may want to clarify your first response to William: “I haven’t worked an Amway business for many, many years. I still get money from it every month.” This may sound surprising or weird to some, considering how knowledgeable you are about the Amway business. On the surface it may sound strange for someone who “[hasn’t] worked an Amway business for many, many years” to call out William for a 10-year-old, outdated perspective.
bleh … how to explain the past decade …. :-/
Good point though AJ. If anyone wants to know, ask! 🙂
That’s one of the cool things about the Amway business–that you can introduce some people to the business, and they continue using the produces many years later, in another continent, and you don’t have to lift a finger, and you still make a little money from that product volume.
To all would be / expectant amway distributors…
You will hear , if you want to grow your business quickly , requires 5 to 7 nights a week. Ask yourself WHY.. Rather ask the speaker/ guru why???
Speaking the truth: because the amway business ROI is so bad/ so poor that 90+ % of the people who start an amway business will quit /stop within a month — because they aren’t making any income .. They are not making any profit.. Neither is anyone of substance teaching them how. If you are not making a profit yourself how can you teach another… Tell the truth from your experience. Not repeating rhetoric. You loose when you repeat repeat rhetoric from tools and functins and what you have heard.. People have no patience for your excuses and what you think … Pople are looking for real leaders who know how ROI works…
Now quit pandering and shinning and fix the issue … It’s time to fix the ROI issue and return to the mass profitability of the late. 70s.
William,
(1)can you name a business that doesn’t require a significant amount of time and effort to get any kind of ROI?
(2)you post makes me feel like we’ve gone back in time 10 years. Are you aware of all the fast track bonuses, retailing training and support, and enforced retailing requirements that Amway North America has had in place for some years now?
According to you, Amway is it:
“1) I haven’t worked an Amway business for many, many years. I still get money from it every month. That’s a “very poor ROI”
The fact you apparently don’t understand that putting in significant effort in to something can generate rewards further down the track, not just immediately, explains a lot about your attitude towards Amway.
The issue I see is too many people putting in an earnest effort and being deceived by some upline leaders who convince them that functions and cds are the only way to succeed. They put in money and effort into a flawed system and get nothing but losses for their efforts.
When will these leaders be held accountable?
In Joecool’s quote, there should be a question mark at the end of “very poor ROI”, since IBOFightBack is providing evidence to discredit what William was saying. Joecool, I don’t know what you’re saying here.
Joecool has likely rehashed his personal experience with Amway from 15 years ago thousands of times on the Internet. That’s probably gotten old for him as well as his readers. Therefore, I’m guessing that Joecool is enjoying this match against IBOFightBack because it gives him something current to write about on his blogs. I wouldn’t be surprised if his audience has increased in activity, a reflection of the activity attached to this article. (There are a lot more comments on this article versus the others from the last couple of months.) Attention on the Internet is a good thing, isn’t it–creates more advertisement revenue?
I ignored him for nearly 2 years. He didn’t go away. 🙁
Re advertising, I was wondering something about that. If Joecool’s blogs have ads, which they do, then he is making money from it, which makes it possible his blog is no longer covered by free speech laws on libel, and instead is considered “commercial speech”.
To clarify what I was thinking, I’m supportive of you for your diligence, and how you are handling this. I was trying to understand Joecool’s motivation. Is it money? Most people who have been mildly burned by something a long time ago, or made a mistake (as in joining Amway, like Joecool did) many years ago, eventually get over it and move on. You’re the closest thing with a relationship to Amway that he can *currently* claim is bugging him. I guess he’s got to keep fueling his hatred somehow.
Regarding your comment on “commercial speech”, does that mean that Joecool could be more vulnerable to libel laws?
I’ve no idea what the underlying source of Nakamura’s obsession is. I went pretty quiet on this blog for the past couple of years, he not only continued posting at nearly a blog idea, he went and found other places to engage people, such as scam.com with nearly 10 posts a day there. And in a comment on his blog he calls me OCD! Hilarious.
Anonymous (ie TEAM) vs Quixtar established in court that if it’s a competitor posting crap about you then it’s clearly commercial and subject to lower standards of free speech protection. What effect selling ad space has I don’t think has been tested.
You have some cute responses, but I don’t see any facts related to business profit and loss. It seems comments are toward thoughts about people experiences and sidebar issues.
No matter how one spins it the amway business has a poor — very poor ROI that even someone in Cuba wouldn’t venture into. Further business princles are almost non existent but instead focus on tools , system functions, seminars and etc. most folks who speak have no business savvy … Unless someone sells a product, close shop and go home.
Further more if a business sells an item ( function ticket, CD, DVD or other) on behalf of any entity then that business should make a profit( ie the newest Amway business should make a profit from selling a tool) . Furthermore if a business entity (person) collects tickets or works at a seminar / door or otherwise, should get compensation in dollars for time spent no matter what amway achievement level.
Hope folks wake up and take this info and make it a reality. Go figure!!!
William,
(1) I haven’t worked an Amway business for many, many years. I still get money from it every month. That’s a “very poor ROI”?
(2) tools/ticket renumeration is volume based, just like many traditional businesses. Buying a handful and reselling does not qualify for a volume discount. If a new person legitimately sells enough tools/tickets to qualify for the discount rate, they’ll likely get it.
(3) At major conventions I’ve been ticket collection is handled by employees, who are compensated. Collecting tickets at a door for smaller seminars takes very little time and compensating volunteer IBOs for this would increase the bureaucratic burden and costs significantly, inevitably raising ticket costs. I’m happy to volunteer and hour or two every few months.
Hey good job IBOFightBack, I dont know who you are but props to you for standing with justice and serving him what he deserved.
You see, the truth will always come out; you can hide, you can scream lies so loud and catch people’s attention, but sooner or later, whoever the liar is, which happens to be Joecool, he will definitely get exposed. He was asking for it. He deserved to be exposed, seriously.
And now he’s trying to pretend he is NOT Steve aka Joecool. Hilarious.
You should check out his new blog; he is framing you for Cyber Bullying / Cyber Stalking.
Dude, I seriously laughed at how he’s trying to justify himself now.
We all know Joecool is Steve, whether he denies it or not. He’s trying to call you a Cyber Stalker now, so be prepared for more lies.
People don’t just stalking people out of nowhere and for no reason. He was asking for it, and now that people expose his true identity, he claims “Ohhh these guys are stalkers.”
Lol, what a silly joke.
Props to you IBOFightBack. I dont know you and you dont know me but just thanks for standing up for righteousness
Thanks for the kind words. He’s been making up stuff about me for years, I care as much now as I did then!
Hi Tony Robinson.
How’s the weather in the UK?
The comment was posted from California and afaik was not from Tony Robinson. And you’re calling me a stalker? Good grief.
Hey! I just saw this! The weather here is not to bad! Thanks for asking!
http://uk.weather.com/
Good job IBOFB! Appreciate all your work. Its about time Joecool and other “critics” are held accountable. Maybe after several of these liars have been exposed the others will think twice before posting poison. Hope it was a good lesson for every quitter out there that wants to get on a blog to justify why…. When you justify mr or ms “critic”, make sure you state the facts. What goes around comes around. The truth will prevail.
I know that “Steve Nakamura” is not Joe Cool’s name. I can tell you that he has $50,000 with which to settle any bets. Let me know if you have any questions. Thanks.
–Daniel
We know, it’s Snoopy.
But just for fun, Daniel, care to point out at which point in the facts outlined, did “joecool” commit fraud, such that the conclusions are wrong?
Hello,
I’m not sure what “facts outlined” you are referring to. The issue is whether or not Joecool’s name is really “Steve Nakumura”, no? Thanks –
—Daniel
Daniel, you’re commenting on an article, perhaps you should read it?
My real life name is no more Steve Nakamura than your real life name is ibofightback.
It’s just a screen name.
You can deny it all you want. But it’s true. That’s why you lost the wager. Pay up.
Even if the name is an alias, your use of the name “Steve Nakamura” in contractual agreements with, for example, LinkedIn, MySpace, and Facebook, not to mention in emails to various people, including government bodies such as the FTC, makes it a common law legally adopted (and thus “real”) name. This does not apply if the use of the name was for the purpose of fraud.
Are you admitting fraud, Steve?
Is the use of ibofightback a fraud?
You are guilty of fraud posting under different names on my blog. I saved all of the IP addresses that you tried to hide behind plus my site meter caught you when you had a failed attempt at using hidemyass to post under a proxy IP address on my blog.
You’re either a liar or an idiot. I have never posted under different names on your blog. Different IP addresses are indicators of different computers and likely different people. That’s how you got caught posting under different names – you were using the same computer and IP address. You’ve babbled on about hidemyass numerous times, again without actually explaining what the hell you’re talking about or providing any proof of evidence of your claims.
You’re just making it up.
I have never used the name “ibofightback” as name on a contract and I acknowledge my “real name” connected to it. You have used the name Steve Nakamura on many occasions in both contractual situations and when linked to your “nicknames” such as joecool and joecool18, yet you now deny it is your name.
Frankly I don’t really care what your name is. What’s important for people to know is the extent of your fraudulent behaviour in order to disparage Amway and Amway IBOs.
Are you seriously saying you never tried using hidemyass.com? Seriously?
And yes, you posted under different names, including anonymous on my blog.
You had a myspace account under the handle of “IBO” and claimed you were from Trinidad and Tobago. You should know this because this was mentioned on that famous “curious george” blog that you cited. Since you have copies, go look it up.
And I’m not sure why you keep harping about me “disparaging” Amway. You know that my primary opposition is to deceiving AMO leaders. My blog hardly has any articles directly critical of Amway.
I have no recollection of ever posting under different names under your blog. It’s possible I may have posted without bothering to fill in the fields (which would have resulted in an “anonymous” post) but I don’t recall it. It’s certainly nothing like you have done,such pretending to be an IBO “Brook” who was part of Network 21 and making up lies about what “she” was taught. Or Peter Parker or Derek and those fake blogs etc etc etc.
Note also that over the years I have regularly had other IBOs living in my house (I do now in fact), all of whom would appear from the same IP address, and some of whom I know have read your blog. I also lived in complex with hundreds of people (some of whom I know were IBOs) all sharing one IP address through a proxy server. I have no idea what they may or may not have posted on your blog.
Now who the hell is Daniel, Joecool’s banker?
well, over on scam.com “joecool44” claimed he had a lawyer in Colorado who would vouch for him. Daniel is a lawyer in Colorado, so I guess that’s him! Of course, Daniel says he can vouch for “joecool”, which is the moniker of the anti-amway blogger who joecool44 says he is not, so I guess Daniel has screwed up there already …. :-/
I laugh every time I hear the justification.
Reminds me of Bill Clinton’s answer to the Grand Jury to confuse the issue, and to rationalize him telling his staff that there wasn’t anything going on with him and Monica Lewinsky, based on a verb tense–“is” versus “was.”
“It depends on what the meaning of the word ‘is’ is. If the–if he–if ‘is’ means is and never has been, that is not–that is one thing. If it means there is none, that was a completely true statement….Now, if someone had asked me on that day, are you having any kind of sexual relations with Ms. Lewinsky, that is, asked me a question in the present tense, I would have said no. And it would have been completely true.”
Great post. Steve is a psychopath who is obessed with Amway. All the while Amway has doubled its sales the last 7 years (from 6 billion to 12 billion) and we have 30 months of consecutive growth in the North American Market. Where is Joe Cools comments after this post? LOL, it’s funny he has nothing to say on this one.
LOL. So you “proved” that Joecool = Steve Nakamura on a “Whatisquixtar” blog that you claim was actually being run by
Joecool?
Bwahahahaha. Funniest thing I’ve seen in a long time.
Wow. English is clearly not your first language. Either that or honesty isn’t. The “whatisquixtar” blog played *zero* role in the proof.
This blog post is extensive, very clearly showing *mulitple* pieces of evidence, pointing to his identity, and he responds this way.
Remember in a comment above where I said Joecool/Steve is unreasonable–unable to reason? This is an example of that.
By the way Kevin, maybe I missed the newswire, but when did Amway announce sales of 12 billion?
stay tuned.
So you’re saying that WWDBKevin’s claim is not true?
no, the exact opposite.
So you’re saying Kevin’s current (false) claim might be true eventually?
Might be true already. How would you know?
Now we know it’s not true. Better luck next year.
I know this is really difficult for you to comprehend, but building a successful business has little to do with luck.
This may be difficult for you to comprehend but WWDBKevin was wrong (or lying) and Amway did not generate 12 billion in sales this past year.
Gee, really? I didn’t know that. Or perhaps I did. I’m sure Kevin knows it too. What’s your point? I must point out of course, that at the same time your pointing out we got some data wrong, over on another forum you’re claiming I must be a paid Amway employee because I post Amway data before they do!
You are an awesome person. It’s a shame that well poisoners like this guy do this. You are polar opposites. The damage that this guy does for the most part affects the brand new IBO, and those they are trying to help break free from mediocrity or worse. I thought I was a pro activist for Amway, as Tennesseesaint on YouTube. I wondered if it made any difference at all, but I think it does. What a shame because bloggers distract from building our businesses, but, they are definitely gushing leaks that must be paid attention to. I admire you greatly. Let me know how I can help, and I will any way I can.
Great job, IBOFB!
I’ve been aware of the joecool/joecool44 connection for quite a while but couldn’t quite make it a solid one, you sure did here!
What fun it is watching him squirm around this!
And still, his retort? “I’m not Steve Nakamura!”
No doubt he’s got multiple personalities, online AND off!
Thanks IBO fightback. Once again a logical, well thought out post. We appreciate the Truth about Amway!
Yes, great post; however, it’s a little sad that people feel compelled to spend so much time and energy on this stuff. Then again, maybe I shouldn’t feel sorry for the super-active bloggers. (I definately don’t feel sorry for Joe Cool. I expect he’s been enjoying himself.) I suppose there’s an income involved when you generate significant traffic to a blog.
Anyways, I was listening to “On the Media” on public radio this morning. The host interviewed Ryan Holiday, a media strategist and author of the new book “Trust Me, I’m Lying: Confessions of a Media Manipulator”. http://www.onthemedia.org/2012/jul/27/?utm_source=local&utm_media=treatment&utm_campaign=carousel&utm_content=item0
The mischief that Holiday was doing on the Internet reminded me of people like Joe Cool. You might enjoy going to the website above and listen to the Holiday interview.
I should point out the Holiday has given up his old, conniving ways. I should have made that clear.
This is a great blog post and really does show JoeCool’s lack of integrity. To be quite honest if someone is going to be swayed to not go into business because of someone like JoeCool, you have to ask yourself, Do you really want to go into business with that kind of person? Probably not.
We want to work with people that have a strong will, that can freely make up their own mind and seek out credible information. Not saying my blog is that credible source, but I encourage people to ask questions and get answers from real sources.
David, well done. *Slow Clap*
I don’t know…for me it’s pretty simple. Individuals *choose* from whom they are going to accept insight, advice, counsel. Some choose well, sticking to that information provided by those who have achieved the results they would also like to achieve. And it’s pretty much a guarantee all of “those” folks are far from perfect. Some choose not-so-well, and accept the counsel of others who have failed to achieve what they hope to achieve. Likewise, “those” folks are far from perfect. Despite Steve’s imperfections, he DOES have information of value…just not the kind of value commensurate with achievement in Amway. Now, clear for anyone who cares to see, he hasroven himself probably NOT the source of choice for people honestly seeking Amway as a potential business opportunity. But, that doesn’t mean he isn’t a source. depends on what one is after. When I was looking for better excuses than I could come-up with on my own, his experience was valuable (and, ironically, somewhat debilitating; but that’s another subject all together.) In any case, whatever impact Steve thinks he had in preventing folks from making a go at Amway, I got a news-flash for him…those people learned nothing, they just “confirmed” their own myopic perspective of what Amway is. They could have chosen the other way, but simply did not. Says WAY more about them than it does about Steve. But, in the end, when you are of the thinking pattern of a Steve, I guess you take whatever “wins” you get…
David, what is Amway’s attitude about all this? Do they monitor this web site? Do they really care what Steve says or does? I don’t! All this attention is probably feeding his ego. Let’s try ignoring him and see what happens.
That approach has been tried Howard (by me for over a year), it made no difference. He continues to post blog after blog, lie after lie – and often attacking me personally while doing so.
Free speech is free speech and in the past at least joecool could hide behind that. He can’t now with what I’ve shown above, but I suspect they’ll just let posts like mine speak for themselves. He’ll continue to do what he does and show the world who he is at the core, and Amway will do the same and continue to grow.
Sorry but no cigar on this one. To prove that he is the poster on scam.com, you have to have his IP address from that site. As for subpoenaing his IP information, that isn’t going to happen. The courts don’t have time and you don’t have reason nor the money to do that unless you’re rich. Being in Amway or any MLM, that is highly unlikely.
Hilarious how the apologist’s rationalise. Did you even bother reading the post? Joecool44 himself said he was Joecool. I’m certainly not taking him to court. What for? To pay up the bet? That would be a waste of the court’s time, and my money, especially given he doesn’t have the money.
I do sometimes wish Amway haul is ass to court though. Heck, he makes it easy – he even admits causing Amway financial damage (ie his sites convincing people not to register) and he’s making money from his blogs, so in theory could be construed as commercial speech, meaning free speech provisions don’t even apply.
But Scott, could you please explain why it is you are supporting someone who is a proven liar and fraud?
Why? Let me think… Birds of a feather flock together? 😉
This isn’t news to those of us who have been in the Amway conversation on the ‘Net the last few years.
But ibofightback, you did an excellent job compiling all this information in one place, will all the evidence to back it up.
Steve will most definitely start to dismantle the stuff he can, in order to cover his tracks, but the PDFs and screenshots tell the tale.
So Steve has patted himself on the back for dissuading folks from registering with Amway, thus interfering with their potential sponsors’ businesses. If true, isn’t there some legal action that can be taken against Mr. Nakamura?
I think Amway should send you that bike…or twelve. 🙂
I’d like to also add, ibofb, that Steve didn’t correct you in your post back in April, when you listed Joecool as Steve Nakamura.
http://www.thetruthaboutamway.com/critiquing-the-critics/
In fact, in his comment back to me, when I mentioned his habit of creating multiple personas, his defense was to, well, lie with a libellous “everybody’s doing it” kind of comment.
http://www.thetruthaboutamway.com/critiquing-the-critics/#comment-7840
After that little exchange (the first in a couple of years) I was reminded that the guy is unreasonable–unable to reason with. So kudos to you for your tenacity in dealing with him.
I see this current post as something to just keep referring to, rather than anyone ever having to engage him again.
A link to this blog post says all that needs to be said.
When they say ” misery loves company”, they weren’t joking. People who dont’ have a sense of vision for themselves always have this mission to get rid of yours with their so called insight with a pessimistic twist in reality always want to have you join them in their pitty party or pessimist groupie! People who come in this business and become a anti-amway centurion will also have the same patterns in their lives. This business is a mirror, it shows you who you really are because it’s not easy and we live in a society today that does not promote self development and self criticism but endulgence and complacency. so It doesn’t surprise me one bit.
BTW, Killer Job IBOfightback! Way to keep us informed.
David,
You did your homework well. Was it worth all the time and effort? Don’t expect to get paid for it. Steve seems to be all hot air!
Howard
Always worth showing what frauds these people are.
People? How about psychopaths? 🙂 🙂 🙂
I am a active ibo and think Amway is a great opportunity I checked out lots of these anti Amway blogs and was not swayed by them as I discovered that if you put other mom company names in the same person seem to be anti them as well with the same comments these people need to get a life or try harder at something. Nothing works without a bit of hard work if financial freedom was easy there would be no problems in the world and everyone would be happy and rich unfortunately to make it you have to work hard take the Kicks and get back up and keep going nothing is free. A happy Amway supporter.
Don’t have time to confirm *every* link, but the few I have leave me with little doubt…
As an aside, Steve is hardly the kind of guy I suspect adheres to his word; you are more likely to get a racing bike from Amway for your efforts than collect 50k for conclusively proving that an obsessive anti-Amway character shows signs of dishonesty, lack of integrity, and questionable ethics…
Takes alot for me to stoop to name calling, but Steve is a tool.
The list is short, if not distinguished… <.<
By the way, if you need a mirror, let me know what I can do to help.
I’m more likely to trip over $50K in the street tomorrow than I am to get Nakamura to pay up. I doubt he has the net worth anyway!
I am absolutely with you. Steve owes you 50K, but there’s no way he has the money considering how he wastes his time.
I read the article and I don’t think joecool is steve. Does anyone really care? While he seems addicted to blogging against amway, some of his writings are accurate and similar to stories that are common on the Internet. Is this personal war really necessary? IBOFB seems to be a smart guy but you’ve let joe get under your skin and reduced you to “I know you but what am I”.
Brad, he admitted he was Steve in blog posts and comments he has since deleted. I rarely visit his blog but I have now, and every single one of the 7 blog posts on his front page is inaccurate. Every. Single. One.
Still, even stopped clocks are right twice a day. Why you need to care is because he is a liar. He lies about Amway. He makes up stories. He makes up personas. Ask yourself this – how many of the “similar to stories” are actually Joecool with yet another fake account? If he’s not Steve, that just is one more page in his lies. That’s what matters, he should not be believed – yet people do.
Aside from that, you’ll note this blog post was written almost a year ago. In the time since I wrote it, Joecool has written around 300 new blog posts, I’ve written about 20. Who is exactly do you think is at war?
He admitted it but you say he is a master of different personas. That’s why I don’t think he is really Steve. Anywt it takes two to tangle so right or wrong you are just playing at his level. His blog has some good articles as does yours. Left the readers judge for themselves and the truth will rise to the top. Amways a big company. I’m sure they can speak for themselves.
I see JoeCool has now written an article criticizing you and calling you a cyberstalker. Will the flame war ever end?
You seem to spend more time reading this stuff than I do writing it! He writes many articles criticising me and spreading BS about me. I haven’t followed his site regularly in years. Anything I should know?
Just curious, what led you to go thru all the time and trouble to write this long post? It seems as if someone with your talents can do something more productive in their time.
He bet me $50000 he wasn’t Steve Nakamura. Of course, he won’t pay up! 🙂
I read your article and Im not convinced that’ he”s really Steve Nkamura.
Depends what you mean by “really”. Since he has used the name in contracts (eg MySpace, FaceBook, and others) as well as used it in emails and in public forums then it is unquestionably one of his legal names. He may or may not use the same name on his driver’s licence.
I don’t think it really matters. What’s more important, no matter what name he uses, is his clear dishonesty and duplicity, setting up fake accounts pretending to be an IBO etc.
I think if you say he used the name Steve Nakamura then you are right but if you say his real name is Steve Nakamura ( name on birth certificate) then I think you are wrong. Was there really a bet? I see someone confirmed that he had the money.
He “challenged” the bet, but the refused to write up the details so he couldn’t sneak out if it and wanted anyone accepting the bet to put their money in a $50K escrow account that he set up before he would do the same. Given his track record of lying an deceit, nobody in their right mind is going to do that.
It was on scam.com that user Joecool44 made the challenge, while claiming he wasn’t Joecool the blogger. In recent weeks he has been claiming that this post is publishing private personal information about he and his wife, which seems to be an admission it’s correct.
I think if he’s a master of creating various user names, then his real identity ia probably not Steve Nakamura. I can’t be sure but that’s my gut feeling. Even thouh there’s a lot of evidence, I don’t see anything that would convince me beyond a doubt.
honestly … don’t care! 🙂
I think you care a whole lot more than you let on. 8)
I think ibofightback means that he doesn’t care if you, “brad,” are convinced beyond a doubt.
He’s not writing for you specifically. Because it’s not about you…whoever that you, that anonymous commenter who goes by the moniker “brad,” is.
Well, don’t care if Brad cares, and really don’t care if Joecool uses the name “steve nakamura” only on the internet or not. The point is the guy is a blatant liar and makes stuff up. That’s all people really need to know.
LOL. That was sort of my point. Have you ever seen the movie spiderman with Toby Maguire? The green goblin tells spidey they can rule the world together or they can beat each other up until they destroy each other. While not the same thing, I see you and JoeCool the same way. On his blog he says you are a liar. Frankly I think you both embellish a little to make your points. I don’t see that as lying and I don’t really see anything wrong with that in a debate.
What I din’t understand is what started the flame war between you two.
Anyway, cheers!
Brad, I’ve pointed out many of joecool’s explicit lies and deception. Creating fake blogs and stories to discredit a company (and in my case, person) goes way beyond “embellish a little”. I’ve asked you before to point out where you see me doing the same and you continue not to do so. I do not appreciate the accusation. Please point out where you think I am being remotely dishonest or even where I “embellesh a little”.
You say he lies He says you lie. I know you are but what am I?
That’s my point. There’s no point. You guys can keep saying it till you’re blue in the face. There’s nothing gained by doing it.
AGAIN, Brad – and you seem to be ignoring this point – I don’t SAY he lies. I SHOW he lies.
LOL. And he shows you lie. It’s a stalemate. That is my point. 🙂
You and your brigade here trash JoeCool and he in turn does the same to you on his blog.
Take the high road. That’s how you’ll look more credible. I told Joe the same thing.
Brad, I have asked you MANY times to point out where I have lied. You continue to fail to do so. If you continue to call me a liar and refuse to back it up with some evidence, you will no longer be welcome to comment on this site. That’s the high road – I won’t let people engage in unfounded attacks, on me or anyone else.
Peace brother. I’m not trying to get banned. I like your website and respect your position a the forum owner. I just think somehow you can promote your position better by promoting the good things and ignoring the critics.
Brad, first of all this post you’re commenting on is well over a year old. You’re the one rehashing it, not me. Secondly, you STILL have refused to point you where you believe I am lying. Please do so.
Sorry, maybe we misunderstand each other. I don’t say you are lying. I am referring to JoeCool. He says you did and cites some examples on his blog. Anyway, sorry, I didn’t realize the post is that old. I just was searching about Amway and your site and JoeCool’s are in the tops of the search ranks.
Brad, you’re dodging. You claimed he “showed” that I lied – ie that he offered proof. You still haven’t explained what it is he “showed” I lied about.
Dude not trying to argue with you but there’s some inaccuracies in this article. I also read the Joecool threat story and it appears that Joe is right. He did not accuse IBO’s of the threat. He said it was some zealot and I read his blog about a canadian who sent him the threat and the IP was there. As I said it seems you will both go to lengths to foul each other. I do agree that Joe making up names to make negative comments is wrong. But please don’t claim you are squeaky clean.
The Amway debate and flame war between you and Joe fascinates me though.
Cheers!
Brad, the “threat” story was posted by Joecool years ago. He edited it several times and I think eventually deleted it, so if you read it, it was years ago. Strange that you’ve only started commenting now. Active bloggers like Bridgett and many others who were active in the community at the time can confirm what I am saying. I think somewhere in my records I have the original web posts saved as screen shots. I’m telling the truth, simple as that. It appears to me your “source” to claim I’m lying is nothing more than Joecool telling you I am.
“Strange that you’ve only started commenting now.”
Exactly. And why I haven’t been responding to “Brad.” This mysterious “Brad” shows up a year after this post was written, and writes the hackneyed, one-sided arguments in relation to Joecool that I’ve witnessed since I’ve been online regarding Amway (which has now been over six years).
Joe fascinates “Brad.” Yeah, sure. 😉
Steve/Joecool is a nobody. He’s been thoroughly exposed in this post, and by other bloggers, like myself, who have referred to this post, for the liar that he is. Sadly, his identity is so wrapped up in being an Amway critic. And so as people have stopped caring about him (because he has zero credibility) he is desperate to keep the conversation going about him. The irony of all this is that Steve criticizes Amway IBOs/ABOs/distributors for being obsessed about Amway, and yet he is the most obsessed person I know regarding Amway (and I know a lot Amway IBOs/ABOs/distributors).
Hi Bridgette, not sure why you feel the need to “attack me”. I just did a search on Amay and found quite a number of sites. This one looked interesting but the JoeCool versus IBOFightback is more interesting.
Maybe I shouldn’t suggest they stop insulting each other? 🙂